When Is It Time To Throw In The Towel?

[Arthur Kill]

I'll echo that West System is great stuff and well worth the cost. It's more or less the standard for both hobbyists and many professional shops. We use the slow hardener for carbon fiber composite layups, and it has about an hour-ish of working time at room temperature, we can usually remove parts from the mold about 24 hours later. If you're working outdoors this time of year or in an unheated garage, you might get a little extra working time and longer cure time. They do make an extra-slow hardener; I would avoid it. Never used it myself, but I have an experienced friend who says it takes an eternity to fully cure.

Good luck with the project, these boats are an absolute blast on the water! I know the pain of a heavy boat, I've been drying mine out all winter. I wish I would have weighed it before I started drying, but it was probably similar to yours. It's noticeably lighter now, and I'm looking forward to seeing how it handles on the water. Yours will get down to something more manageable eventually.

Thanks for the info. Most of the generic kit combos of resin/hardener for novices I've seen so far don't have an option for the speed of the drying process - but I've heard it spoken of here many times. I'm still learning.

I have the boat at the edge of my driveway right now with a computer fan running. So, it's kinda in the way and the extension cord is a tripping hazard for the kids. So, I'm probably gonna move it to the back yard with the realization that this is gonna take months, not weeks. I'm also not convinced that the fan is doing much. I smoke tested the exit/cut and I didn't notice a big difference between in air flow between fan/no fan. Any passing breeze or gust of wind seems to move the internal air pretty efficiently so I'll probably bag the fan and extension cord. Natural will take it's course.

Can't wait till it's a manageable weight and to finally get it in the water.

 

[Arthur Kill]

U.S. Composits has on line ordering for retail consumers and are less expensive than any other source we researched. Good quality products and quick shipping. They carry everything you need to make fiberglass repairs. Good luck!

Checking that now, thanks for the tip!!

 

[tag]

If you are blowing air in through a port hole, another option for more air flow than a typical computer fan is a duct booster fan, you can get them at Home Depot or similar hardware stores (or online). If I recall correctly, somehow the one I bought fits tightly in the port hole as well - maybe it was a 5" one?

Something like this: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Suncourt-Inductor-4-in-Corded-In-Line-Duct-Fan-DB204C/206584727

 

[Arthur Kill]

If you are blowing air in through a port hole, another option for more air flow than a typical computer fan is a duct booster fan, you can get them at Home Depot or similar hardware stores (or online). If I recall correctly, somehow the one I bought fits tightly in the port hole as well - maybe it was a 5" one?

Something like this: https://www.homedepot.com/p/Suncourt-Inductor-4-in-Corded-In-Line-Duct-Fan-DB204C/206584727

That looks like it was custom made to blow air into the hull of a Sunfish!

But alas, I have no power source in the area of my yard where the boat is going, so it's gonna be all natural. I think I'm gonna cut a deck plate / inspection port in the back, like alotta SF's have. So, I should have very good natural air flow.

Thanks!

 

[Arthur Kill]

NEW QUESTIONS:

What is the proper size inspection port for the back of a Sunfish?

Since I won't yet have the actual port, what size hole should I cut?

Should I use a dremel cut-off wheel or a jig-saw?

Thanks!!

 

[LVW]

The last Marine-Tex I bought was $25. It works well, as it provides a very hard, gelcoat-like surface. Because it resists sanding, I'd suggest using something else.

For pinholes, and other defects, I've been using an automotive "glazing-compound"; however, it's about 30 years old, and not sure where to get more (should I need it--as a little goes a long way!)

 

[LVW]

For a rear port, some Styrofoam flotation has to pulled out and discarded. I wouldn't install a rear port unless it's necessary for gudgeon access. Sizes may be listed, but I'd use the actual port as a template, because sizes can vary, due to proprietary dimensions.

For more effective hull ventilation, I'd get a bigger muffin fan and duct it with cardboard, aluminum roofing "valley-flashing" ($10), or just lots of duct tape (Also written, "duck tape"). That new cutout has enough surface area to work just fine with a four-inch muffin fan ($12).

Wind gusts may occasionally overpower the fan, but won't hurt it, either.

 

[signal charlie]

You can visit our blog and youtube and search for fiberglass repairs or wet foam. Most of the info is also searchable on this site as well.

Small Boat Restoration

https://www.youtube.com/user/kentblairl

We like to get our repair supplies from Jamestown Distributors aka TotalBoat. We use epoxy resin/hardener kits.
Wooden battens are fine.
The key to Sunfish health is to fix any leak, otherwise foam, wooden backer blocks etc will absorb water.
For internal backer patches we use fiberglass woven roving, which is what the hull is made of.
If we don't reuse the fiberglass cutout we build up low spots with 4 oz fiberglass cloth, leaving the repair area a little shallow for sanding and fairing
For fairing we love TotalBoat Total Fair. Bondo will absorb water.
Gelcoat is what protects the fiberglass, but we are not smart on gelcoat. Small spot repair kits are available. We paint, either spray with rattle can Rust-Oleum Satin white or roll and tip one part marine polyurethane paint, WetEdge, Brightside, EZpoxy, or Kirby oil.

Don't overthink the paint on the bottom, as the boat will most likely be a Beach Banger (Glos, 2011).

An air leak test should be done ASAP, so that you can repair all leak areas while the repair materials are handy. Get the boat watertight first then shift to making it purty.

 

[signal charlie]

PS It is not time to throw in the towel.

 

[Wavedancer]

Never had a problem sanding MarineTex surfaces.

 

[Arthur Kill]

You can visit our blog and youtube and search for fiberglass repairs or wet foam. Most of the info is also searchable on this site as well.

Small Boat Restoration

https://www.youtube.com/user/kentblairl

We like to get our repair supplies from Jamestown Distributors aka TotalBoat. We use epoxy resin/hardener kits.
Wooden battens are fine.
The key to Sunfish health is to fix any leak, otherwise foam, wooden backer blocks etc will absorb water.
For internal backer patches we use fiberglass woven roving, which is what the hull is made of.
If we don't reuse the fiberglass cutout we build up low spots with 4 oz fiberglass cloth, leaving the repair area a little shallow for sanding and fairing
For fairing we love TotalBoat Total Fair. Bondo will absorb water.
Gelcoat is what protects the fiberglass, but we are not smart on gelcoat. Small spot repair kits are available. We paint, either spray with rattle can Rust-Oleum Satin white or roll and tip one part marine polyurethane paint, WetEdge, Brightside, EZpoxy, or Kirby oil.

Don't overthink the paint on the bottom, as the boat will most likely be a Beach Banger (Glos, 2011).

An air leak test should be done ASAP, so that you can repair all leak areas while the repair materials are handy. Get the boat watertight first then shift to making it purty.

Thank you Kent very much for the useful advice - I have watched several of your videos on YT and they're a great learning tool! I'm very jealous of your shop setup!

"Bondo" is that generic term that is generally synonymous with poorly done auto-body filler for any "car-guy" - but the brand name has a variety of different products today which have become available at Home Depot, some are specificlly for boat/fiberglass repair. Which only makes things more confusing for me as someone who is brand-new to boat repair.

Bondo 41 oz. Short Strand Fiberglass Filler -- Bondo Fiberglass Resin & Repair Kit, .9 Quart -- Bondo 1 qt. All-Purpose Putty

But reading your above, I think I now know what "fairing" means in this sense.

Interesting take on painting - I like it! Once dried to a manageable weight, this boat will be repaired, but NOT painted until the on-water testing is satisfactorily completed. So, for those initial voyages, it's gonna have a real "rat-rod" appearance, which I hope does not insult the purists.

While I have your expert ear, let me ask you: because this Sunfish is turning into an extended project and because I'd like to sail early this summer, I'm looking at obtaining a Sailfish locally -- it's OLD - it's gotta be the first or second year of the fiberglass edition, so I'm guessing the DOM to be around 1960, give-or-take. The only identifier I could find on the boat, is a riveted (and very weather-worn) metal plate that appears to have the number 13136 stamped into it. I know that it lived indoors most of it's life, until the last 10 or so years. The hull shows no signs of damage or repair, nor does the deck -- and the bumper rails appear to have suffered no major damage.

Having "water-log shock" I actually weighed the boat on a bathroom scale - 130 pounds.

Questions:
- Do you suppose this boat is "ready-to-sail" with a just little elbow grease?
- With a boat this age, am I asking for trouble? Does fibergflass degrade over time and get brittle/less robust?
- What else should I look for that would be cause for this boat turning into another undesired "headache project?"

Thank you in advance for any and all advice. Much appreciated.

 

[Arthur Kill]

For a rear port, some Styrofoam flotation has to pulled out and discarded. I wouldn't install a rear port unless it's necessary for gudgeon access. Sizes may be listed, but I'd use the actual port as a template, because sizes can vary, due to proprietary dimensions.

For more effective hull ventilation, I'd get a bigger muffin fan and duct it with cardboard, aluminum roofing "valley-flashing" ($10), or just lots of duct tape (Also written, "duck tape"). That new cutout has enough surface area to work just fine with a four-inch muffin fan ($12).

Wind gusts may occasionally overpower the fan, but won't hurt it, either.

Thanks again, LVW. By your advice, I will not do the rear hatch.

Much appreciated.

 

[signal charlie]

As for Bondo putty, it is water "resistant" just like the closed cell foam inside the Sunfish/Sailfish. Over time the foam or putty will absorb water. I've read that bondo putty will flake off over time, so we've avoided using it.

Fairing compounds are softer and easier to sand than epoxy resins or polyester resins. We use TotalFair or Pettit EZFair. Either type resin is fine for a repair, the boat was built with poly resin/hardener and poly is usually cheaper. Epoxy resins are not as smelly and you'll find them at most marine stores, online etc, we like using thickened epoxy or even thickened flexible epoxy as it sticks well and doesn't run during the early stages of curing, plus the thickened resin can be piled up a bit along with layers of fiberglass cloth. It takes a little more patience to wet out cloth with thickened resin but we have done it many times. A lot of marine stores sell through Amazon now so supplies can usually show up in a day or two. IF you end up using the TotalBoat line and create an account, you can try our Ambassador Code SMALLBOATS to save around 10-15% on TotalBoat products.

We use all brands of paint, especially free THIXO Flex that Jamestown Distributors sends us
How do we choose?
1. We pick the color paint and brand we want first.
2. Then we choose primer and fairing compound that is either from the same product line or THAT WE KNOW is compatible with the paint. Sea Foam Green is one example, many folks sell it but our favorite Sea Foam Green is sold by Pettit.
3. Rust-Oleum sells a marine paint in a can, Topside, that can be found at some Lowes. It's a good looking paint but has not lasted as long as Pettit, Interlux, WetEdge, Kirby. Valspar also has an oil based enamel, Ultra 4000, which could be mixed to many colors.

We've mixed and matched brands but only after checking with the Jamestown Distributors Tech Team.

As for the fiberglass Super Sailfish MKII, that Serial No. matches up to 1964. The advertising material says 98 pounds, but we've found those numbers to be very optimistic. Water is 8.35 pounds per gallon, so that boat has something hiding inside somewhere. The fiberglass from those years is bomb proof, but the daggerboards are too short. The Sailfish is a fun, wet boat, "the boat you learn to swim on."

 

[Arthur Kill]

As for Bondo putty, it is water "resistant" just like the closed cell foam inside the Sunfish/Sailfish. Over time the foam or putty will absorb water. I've read that bondo putty will flake off over time, so we've avoided using it.

Fairing compounds are softer and easier to sand than epoxy resins or polyester resins. We use TotalFair or Pettit EZFair. Either type resin is fine for a repair, the boat was built with poly resin/hardener and poly is usually cheaper. Epoxy resins are not as smelly and you'll find them at most marine stores, online etc, we like using thickened epoxy or even thickened flexible epoxy as it sticks well and doesn't run during the early stages of curing, plus the thickened resin can be piled up a bit along with layers of fiberglass cloth. It takes a little more patience to wet out cloth with thickened resin but we have done it many times. A lot of marine stores sell through Amazon now so supplies can usually show up in a day or two. IF you end up using the TotalBoat line and create an account, you can try our Ambassador Code SMALLBOATS to save around 10-15% on TotalBoat products.

We use all brands of paint, especially free THIXO Flex that Jamestown Distributors sends us
How do we choose?
1. We pick the color paint and brand we want first.
2. Then we choose primer and fairing compound that is either from the same product line or THAT WE KNOW is compatible with the paint. Sea Foam Green is one example, many folks sell it but our favorite Sea Foam Green is sold by Pettit.
3. Rust-Oleum sells a marine paint in a can, Topside, that can be found at some Lowes. It's a good looking paint but has not lasted as long as Pettit, Interlux, WetEdge, Kirby. Valspar also has an oil based enamel, Ultra 4000, which could be mixed to many colors.



We've mixed and matched brands but only after checking with the Jamestown Distributors Tech Team.

As for the fiberglass Super Sailfish MKII, that Serial No. matches up to 1964. The advertising material says 98 pounds, but we've found those numbers to be very optimistic. Water is 8.35 pounds per gallon, so that boat has something hiding inside somewhere. The fiberglass from those years is bomb proof, but the daggerboards are too short. The Sailfish is a fun, wet boat, "the boat you learn to swim on."

View attachment 55231

Thank you very much, Kent. All of this invaluable information has been transferred to my permanent guide files.

In this video, at arourd the 8:30 mark, "Scotty applies thin, resin-based skim-coat" to "fill-in any low-spots and pinholes" - I assumed that was "Bondo" but I'll assume it is not from what I've learned here in this forum. They don't mention a brand name - what do you suppose that substance is?

Thank you!!

 

[Arthur Kill]

DRYING UPDATE:

Yesterday, I moved the boat from it's problematic place in the driveway, to the back of the back yard. There is no source for power here but it can sit, unbothered for an extended period. I weighed it prior to the move, 280 pounds.

These means I read the scale wrong last week when I reported 255 - it was more likely 285. Because of the unmanageable weight, trying to balance the boat on a bathroom scale is a very awkward and precarious task, it's difficult to get a staright-on view of the scales display while trying to steady the morbidly over-weight beast. So, an erroneous reading is not surprising.

Also, the vast majority of the weight is in the back of the boat - I'd estimate 85 percent.

@LVW > Should I revisit the idea of cutting a new inspection port in the back to get some air flowing there? Mind you, there is no power, therefore, no fan applied in the boat's present location.

Thank you!!

 

[tag]

You've mentioned no power a couple times - can you run an extension cord? I think a fan (increased airflow) will greatly increase your boat's weight loss program...

 

[Arthur Kill]

You've mentioned no power a couple times - can you run an extension cord? I think a fan (increased airflow) will greatly increase your boat's weight loss program...

Nocando. It's too far from any power source and an extension cord will constantly be in the way (dog, kids, people, lawn maintenance etc). Not surprisingly, I can't find any experiences on the interwebs that would quantifiably compare the increase in drying time with a low-flow (or computer fan) to no fan at all, for an outdoor dry-out.

But I don't disagree, common-sense dictates; air movement dries stuff.

Like I said, I smoke tested the "exit" cut I made in the hull and saw no detectable air-flow difference between fan and no fan. Any random passing breeze was the only significant catalyst for air movement.

The boat lost 5 pounds in one week with the computer fan running 24/7 - I also pumped heat into the hull 2 times during the week for about 8 hours each time (worried about the potential fire hazard). So, I'll weigh the boat again next Sunday and get a more accurate comparison.

 

[LVW]

Nice job of ducting! (And I own three of those same heaters--two are branded Pelonis). If the water weight is rearward, consider ducting the fan through your new cut. Air movement is key to moving moisture.

Yours is much easier job than getting my 20-foot O'Day Mariner dried out. I got it for free, but could hardly move it!

I've also got 100-foot extension cords, which I hang from hooks and overhead branches to avoid a trip-hazard. I'd use my $1 solar fan under a glass cover, but it's too small to move much air. The $14 ducted kitchen fan at Home Depot would be ideal.

You could put in a 6-inch rear port, and pull out all the wet Styrofoam. I did that with my old Porpoise II. It can be replaced (to advantage) with the durable Pond and Stone expanding foam by Great Stuff.

 

[beldar boathead]

This is probably not practical, and I am no electrical expert, but could you get a 12 volt DC fan, connect it to a car battery, and run a fan that way? One obvious problem is that you probably don't have any spare car batteries lying around, but thought I'd mention it anyway.

 

[Arthur Kill]

Nice job of ducting! (And I own three of those same heaters--two are branded Pelonis). If the water weight is rearward, consider ducting the fan through your new cut. Air movement is key to moving moisture.

Yours is much easier job than getting my 20-foot O'Day Mariner dried out. I got it for free, but could hardly move it!

I've also got 100-foot extension cords, which I hang from hooks and overhead branches to avoid a trip-hazard. I'd use my $1 solar fan under a glass cover, but it's too small to move much air. The $14 ducted kitchen fan at Home Depot would be ideal.

You could put in a 6-inch rear port, and pull out all the wet Styrofoam. I did that with my old Porpoise II. It can be replaced (to advantage) with the durable Pond and Stone expanding foam by Great Stuff.

I think that's what I need to do.

The inspection hatches come in 4, 6 and 8 inches on Amazon. Since I don't have the hatch yet, I'll cut the hole 1/2" smaller and finish it when the part arrives.

Sound good?

And then pull out ALL of the foam back there? How much Pond and Stone expanding foam by Great Stuff will I need? One or 2 cans? That "stuff" goes a long way.

Use a jigsaw for the round cut, correct? (I have a lot of questions but I may do this as soon as today or tomrrow).

 

[Gail]

In these files are all the instructions you need for making repairs, bubble testing (should do first to find your first round of leaks, then make fixes and test again, just no high powered blower or you'll blow the deck off the two-part expanding foam that glued the Styrofoam blocks in place, they are structural). Log In.

The deck is in pretty good shape. Any hull can be fixed. Take your time, read and prepare. I have two that are just repaired and look good as new!

Once you bubble test and there's no or few bubbles, go sailing. Then dry again. NO REASON NOT TO SAIL unless it takes LOTS of water in a short time. So what it weighs 150 when you start, just sail! You'll likely get it down to 135 pounds eventually. Today's new boats are speced at 120, but they're built differently (they're also not holding up very well).

You say you'll be doing it all outdoors. The black garbage bag method in the sun, a lightbulb inside, etc., for heat is important. If ambient air temperature is low, it will likely take longer. Hair dryers help (I've burned out many!), but warmer weather truly helps. What you're doing is turning the water in the Styrofoam and 2-part expanding foam back into water vapor and evaportating it out of the inside of the hull. Those same 2 boats above each weighed over 180, now are at 130.

Also, keep something over the holes, squirrels really like to move into these nice, tidy, small dry places and make nests and total mayhem!

Good luck with your repairs!

 

[Gail]

Yep, pic above. Whatcha think?

Is Marine Tex a final/skim coat? I've seen YT vids where guys use Bondo to fill leftover "pinholes" after the fiberglass process. Same or similar?

No Bondo, it holds water. Marine Tex is OK, but gel is better.

 

[Wavedancer]

No Bondo, it holds water. Marine Tex is OK, but gel is better.

Gelcoating larger areas is not for 'beginners' unless you have a specialist to apply it for you.

 

[Breeze Bender]

Never had a problem sanding MarineTex surfaces.

Me either! A little Saran Wrap over the repair, then smooth out over the Saran when partially cured. Sanding isn’t bad at all

 

[LVW]

I think that's what I need to do.

The inspection hatches come in 4, 6 and 8 inches on Amazon. Since I don't have the hatch yet, I'll cut the hole 1/2" smaller and finish it when the part arrives.

Sound good?

And then pull out ALL of the foam back there? How much Pond and Stone expanding foam by Great Stuff will I need? One or 2 cans? That "stuff" goes a long way.

Use a jigsaw for the round cut, correct? (I have a lot of questions but I may do this as soon as today or tomrrow).

I think that's what I need to do.

The inspection hatches come in 4, 6 and 8 inches on Amazon. Since I don't have the hatch yet, I'll cut the hole 1/2" smaller and finish it when the part arrives.

Sound good?

And then pull out ALL of the foam back there? How much Pond and Stone expanding foam by Great Stuff will I need? One or 2 cans? That "stuff" goes a long way.

Use a jigsaw for the round cut, correct? (I have a lot of questions but I may do this as soon as today or tomrrow).

Even with an 8-inch port, you won't be able to reach all the soggy Styrofoam back there, but hopefully to make a big difference. I'd leave any dry (white) Styrofoam in place. It's a messy operation, so have a garbage bag handy.

I use a "saber-saw"--same thing? There's nothing to damage back there anyway. Save the intact piece you cut out for future repairs.

Pond and Stone foam is not as supportive as the original Styrofoam, but you can make up for it with VOLUME. Two cans ought to do it, and the instructions say to add (!) water for a faster cure. (The rear deck doesn't get the abuse that the rest of the boat does). Apply with the boat on its side.

While my problem creature is Florida's ants, I'd take Gail's advice and screen all openings as best you can.

 

[beldar boathead]

I’d get an 6 inch port. I’d also only remove the yellow foam. As mentioned the white stuff is structural. I wouldn’t just pull everything out and spray in Great Stuff. The white blocks will dry, as Gail says.

 

[signal charlie]

The first photo is not ours, but a good one, whoever took it. The white blocks are structural closed cell, expanded polystyrene (XPS), held in place with marine grade 2 part expanding adhesive foam, also closed cell. While closed cell foam absorbs water much slower than regular extruded styrofoam, it does absorb water ove time if left submerged. According to you weight numbers, you have almost 30 gallons of water hiding in there somewhere!

Alcort used to hand pour foam and it was much neater inside. Then AMF got a foam gun in the early 1970s and as Howie put it, "there was foam everywhere." A lot of late 1970s - early 1980s boats have what we call the big cheeseburger back in the stern.

There's 40 pounds of wet foam that we pulled out of a 1980 boat.

On this photo you can see where moisture condensed over the foam block/expanding foam.

If you use any expanding foam anywhere, be sure to wear long sleeves and gloves. Do NOT get it on your skin! Ask me how I know...

 

[Breeze Bender]

I know you’re anxious to get work done, but I wouldn’t cut the hole until you have the port. Don’t use an 8” port, it’s too big! 6” max. I prefer 4.5” or 5” but if you’re going to be scooping out foam go with 6”. Don’t remove the white blocks, just the wet yellow stuff.
Without access to a fan you’re going to have a wet boat for a long time. Not sure why you can’t move boat closer to a power source? Black plastic will help, but you really want to get the air circulating in there to dry things out.

 

[LVW]

Pond & Stone comes with a 8-inch "application straw". Use it to apply the product above and below any structural foam that is "working" for you. This foam product will attach itself to everything (including skin) but the manufacturer assures the user that it will wear off skin eventually.

The edges of the hole should be covered with tape to prevent a very annoying rash from tiny glass fibers.

After spraying about half one can's weight, observe how the foam is spreading. Apply more in the "weaker" direction as needed. It does seem to have a mind of its own... You may need to know when to run away!

The "straw" and the remaining contents can be used a bit later, but it's very sensitive to time/ temperature during storage. I use a narrow bamboo "kebob grilling skewer" to clear the straw of obstructing foam. ('Generous set for $1.25 at Dollar Tree).

 

[Arthur Kill]

Pond & Stone comes with a 8-inch "application straw". Use it to apply the product above and below any structural foam that is "working" for you. This foam product will attach itself to everything (including skin) but the manufacturer assures the user that it will wear off skin eventually.

The edges of the hole should be covered with tape to prevent a very annoying rash from tiny glass fibers.

After spraying about half one can's weight, observe how the foam is spreading. Apply more in the "weaker" direction as needed. It does seem to have a mind of its own... You may need to know when to run away!

The "straw" and the remaining contents can be used a bit later, but it's very sensitive to time/ temperature during storage. I use a narrow bamboo "kebob grilling skewer" to clear the straw of obstructing foam. ('Generous set for $1.25 at Dollar Tree).

Thank you so much @LVW for the detailed explanation - I'm digesting every word and I really appreciate having your guidance.

- Also big thanks to @Breeze Bender - @signal charlie - @beldar boathead - @Gail and @tag - thank you very much for your expert input and advice.

There is a lot to digest here and I hope I'm not a pest - especially when I come back and double/triple check or ask for crazily novice specific details about what's already been posted - cause that's bound happen.



This is a great forum because of all the amazing people here.

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!

 

[Breeze Bender]

-THANK YOU SO MUCH!!

You’re welcome, and you’re right, this forum is outstanding- friendly people and loaded with valuable information and resources. I gotta say, I’m on a couple of Facebook groups that are NOT the same!
Don’t hesitate to ask away- I learned everything I know about Sunfish repair from the wise peeps on this forum, and I’m sure I’ve asked hundreds of questions over the years! It’s fun when I can pass on a bit of advice from what I’ve gained here.

 

[beldar boathead]

And you can see from where the foam is based on where there is condensation, and where there is not.

 

[signal charlie]

As Beldar points out, the entire hull is not full of foam. There are six 2 inch wide XPS foam blocks and just enough, in theory, marine grade adhesive foam to hold those six blocks in place. Your Boats Mileage May Vary (YBMMV).

Great Stuff is not "marine grade" but for that matter neither are the factory XPS blocks or any two part expanding marine adhesive/flotation foam. Any of these materials will absorb water over extended time. So our focus is in fixing leaks, keeping them fixed and making sure there is no water inside a hull when it is stored.

I doubt you'll go this direction, but the factory repair for wet foam in 1960-1987 boats would be to split the deck/hull seam, then remove and replace the foam. It's intrusive and labor intensive. We do not replace the white YXP foam block, as it is impossible to find economically, but the yellow foam has several supply sources and varieties.

There is also an art to how much of the deck edge seam can be split and how much deck can be lifted.
-Never split the entire seam, as it is very hard to align the seam during reassembly. Leave the sam alongside the cockpit edge intact.
-Do not cut away the seams for the mast step, trunk or cockpit.
-A deck plate between the coaming and daggerboard trunk is a good access point to inspect the innards and sponge out small amounts of water.
-There are over 30 designed holes in the hull, plus 32 feet of deck edge seam and more cockpit tub seam, etc...
-And a vent hole, so it is impossible to keep moisture out of the inside of the hull. Have a plan to drain any excess moisture via deck drain or deck plate.
-Do not plug the hull vent, the innards can heat up an pop a seam or pop a block loose.
-Don't add a stern plug drain. It is only marginally useful and in the long run, a big hole below the waterline.

The boat above turned into this sweet Army Air Corps tribute boat, I believe it was Alex Bryan of ALCORT who was in the Army Air Corps during WWII. MERCI is her name and she was sold to an 8 year old girl, who was wearing a tutu at the time of purchase. We asked her where she was going to sail MERCI and she said "Annnnnnywhere I want."

 

[LVW]

Here's a suggestion for replacing fiberglass battens with something better. Over a plastic sheet, stretch and tape the tip-ends of three inch (by ~18") sections of fiberglass tape (or cloth) alongside your cuts.

Pre-cut the four cloth sections. Apply resin to the cloth, add another layer of cloth and resin. Remove bubbles.

Let it cure and cut off the non-impregnated tips. With your grinder, roughen the upper side (the upside), coat with resin, and clamp where the batten was to go. It will approximate the curve of the repair, be stronger than any batten, and gain a beginner some experience using resin, cloth/tape, and a brush/roller.

Regular "Great Stuff" is white. Black "Pond and Stone" is designed to construct outdoor garden ponds. For days, I've pressed leftover "Pond and Stone" foam under water, with absolutely no increase in moisture content or weight. Cup-shaped scraps will "bead" water.

 

[Arthur Kill]

Here's a suggestion for replacing fiberglass battens with something better. Over a plastic sheet, stretch and tape the tip-ends of three inch (by ~18") sections of fiberglass tape (or cloth) alongside your cuts.

Pre-cut the four cloth sections. Apply resin to the cloth, add another layer of cloth and resin. Remove bubbles.

Let it cure and cut off the non-impregnated tips. With your grinder, roughen the upper side (the upside), coat with resin, and clamp where the batten was to go. It will approximate the curve of the repair, be stronger than any batten, and gain a beginner some experience using resin, cloth/tape, and a brush/roller.

Regular "Great Stuff" is white. Black "Pond and Stone" is designed to construct outdoor garden ponds. For days, I've pressed leftover "Pond and Stone" foam under water, with absolutely no increase in moisture content or weight. Cup-shaped scraps will "bead" water.

Awesome info, thanks @LVW !!

PS - the brand name of that space heater is "Titan." I purchased 2 of them for $5 bucks at the liquidation of a rent-all store more than 20 years ago.

As Beldar points out, the entire hull is not full of foam. There are six 2 inch wide XPS foam blocks and just enough, in theory, marine grade adhesive foam to hold those six blocks in place. Your Boats Mileage May Vary (YBMMV).

Great Stuff is not "marine grade" but for that matter neither are the factory XPS blocks or any two part expanding marine adhesive/flotation foam. Any of these materials will absorb water over extended time. So our focus is in fixing leaks, keeping them fixed and making sure there is no water inside a hull when it is stored.

I doubt you'll go this direction, but the factory repair for wet foam in 1960-1987 boats would be to split the deck/hull seam, then remove and replace the foam. It's intrusive and labor intensive. We do not replace the white YXP foam block, as it is impossible to find economically, but the yellow foam has several supply sources and varieties.

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There is also an art to how much of the deck edge seam can be split and how much deck can be lifted.
-Never split the entire seam, as it is very hard to align the seam during reassembly. Leave the sam alongside the cockpit edge intact.
-Do not cut away the seams for the mast step, trunk or cockpit.
-A deck plate between the coaming and daggerboard trunk is a good access point to inspect the innards and sponge out small amounts of water.
-There are over 30 designed holes in the hull, plus 32 feet of deck edge seam and more cockpit tub seam, etc...
-And a vent hole, so it is impossible to keep moisture out of the inside of the hull. Have a plan to drain any excess moisture via deck drain or deck plate.
-Do not plug the hull vent, the innards can heat up an pop a seam or pop a block loose.
-Don't add a stern plug drain. It is only marginally useful and in the long run, a big hole below the waterline.

The boat above turned into this sweet Army Air Corps tribute boat, I believe it was Alex Bryan of ALCORT who was in the Army Air Corps during WWII. MERCI is her name and she was sold to an 8 year old girl, who was wearing a tutu at the time of purchase. We asked her where she was going to sail MERCI and she said "Annnnnnywhere I want."

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Thanks Kent - before I forget, what is the "hull vent?" Mine has a hole in the deck at the right/rear corner of the boat. Is that it? (pic below)

Thanks for the info! That boat is sa-weet!!

So, I cut an inspection port in the rear of the boat today, what a friggin nightmare!! There is a LOT of foam in there and each handful I took out squeezed out water like a kitchen sponge that was submerged. I think the ONLY way to do this is gonna be to split and lift the rear. It'll save MONTHS of drying time -- but how heavy it is and how much water is in the foam, I not sure if it would ever dry.

 

[signal charlie]

Get as much as you can through the port, that will depend on the size of your arm/forearm as to whether you can get in past the elbow! The bulk of the yellow foam you are wanting to get out will be right there in the stern, maybe a 2-3 foot diameter blob. A

As you are doing, leave the white foam block in place.

The hull vent should be high on the forward cockpit wall, about 1/8th inch diameter. Just above the AMF Alcort sticker if you still have it. (Someone else's photo below, not ours, but a good one)