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How's My Rigging?

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
The wind has calmed enough for me to do a test rigging. Hoping you all won't mind taking a look and let me know if something doesn't look right.

 

beldar boathead

Well-Known Member
I’d put 2 loops of duct tape around the lower boom and run the sheet thru the loops. That will keep the sheet from catching around your hat or your neck when you tack or gybe. Intensity sell Velcro loops but tape works just as well.

Not sure you need a vang as a beginner, but it pulls down on the gooseneck and that is why the gooseneck is angled, but that makes no difference.

Also, all lines stretch a bit. To minimize halyard stretch, cleat the halyard after it passes through the fair lead, then tie the vang. As it is now, it’s got a couple extra feet forming the vang that can stretch.

Looks like you are ready to sail!!
 

Wavedancer

Upside down?
Staff member
Looks good to me. Try to not leave any slack between the gaff and the top of the mast. In other words, tighten the halyard as much as possible.
And yes, you can reposition the gooseneck on the boom so that it will slide better along the mast.

PS: I run the 'vang' through the hole in the deck cleat, but what the heck...
 

LaLi

Well-Known Member
In the video the same line (the halyard) pulls the gaff up with a 1:1, and the (lower) boom down with a 2:1 purchase. Tightening it would just bring the gooseneck down to the deck, and it's actually impossible to keep the gaff all the way up. You'll need to cleat the "halyard" and "vang" parts separately, like beldar already suggested.

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Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
Not sure what you mean by cleating the halyard and vang parts seprately. I've only got one line at the front, which is the halyard. Am I supposed to have another sheet up there?

Nevermind, I see what you and beldar are saying. You're saying that instead of going fairlead, over the gooseneck and then to the cleat, you're saying I should go through the fairlead, cleat, over the gooseneck and then cleat again?
 

tag

my2fish
Missing sail clip?
18DD2176-E46F-4B2A-A930-24BFB89F68E7.jpeg
I agree the vang isn’t that important for a new rec sailor. But adding a mast cleat does make that vang rigging easier to set up.
 

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
Looks like both the clew and head lack the tie line around the spar. Like so often, 3 mm Dyneema is your friend here.

_
Are you talking about this? According to the instructions, I only need to rig that way if I'm racing. Since I'm not, I didn't.

1623091310474.png
 

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
Perhaps some tape on the top spar to stop the boom-hitch from slipping?
Probably wouldn't hurt, but I didn't bother based off of this post I found while researching how to rig the thing.

1623091478646.png

I just replicated that knot and it seems to be holding well! If it poses problems in the future I'll definitely add some tape.
 

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
Guybrush, you can Google head and clew to see where he is recommending a piece of line.
I know which parts of the sail are the head and the clew, I'm just not sure what he's saying I do with them. Aren't they already tied in place at the ends? Are you guys saying I also need to tie it around the spars on the end (I've indicated this using yellow lines)? 69BBBACB-3601-4698-AED4-5159461FEE74.jpg
1623094339123.png
 

tag

my2fish
whether you are sailing your Sunfish for racing or recreational, I would recommend a sail tie or clip at the head, clew, and 2x at the tack (1x on each spar).



I would also add one as I noted above at the 1st grommet above the tack on the upper spar. this grommet can also be used to rig a cunningham (not necessary for rec sailing).

I realize that the LP Sunfish manual doesn't show sail ties at a couple of these locations for recreational sailing, but it will help your sail shape and all it takes is a couple short lengths of line.
 

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
whether you are sailing your Sunfish for racing or recreational, I would recommend a sail tie or clip at the head, clew, and 2x at the tack (1x on each spar).



I would also add one as I noted above at the 1st grommet above the tack on the upper spar. this grommet can also be used to rig a cunningham (not necessary for rec sailing).

I realize that the LP Sunfish manual doesn't show sail ties at a couple of these locations for recreational sailing, but it will help your sail shape and all it takes is a couple short lengths of line.
No problem. I have some leftover line from doing the ends I can use. Hard to make out in that picture but I'm guessing they're just square knots? Oh, and how tight to the spars should they be?
 

LaLi

Well-Known Member
Aren't they already tied in place at the ends? Are you guys saying I also need to tie it around the spars on the end (I've indicated this using yellow lines)?
View attachment 46395
Yes. Tag already said it very well. Think of those yellow lines as the ones that tie the sail corners "in place", taking most of the leech load. The blue lines are for adjusting foot and luff tension along the spars.

_
 

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
Ok, made the changes as suggested. Here’s an updated video. Let me know what you think.

I’m 90% sure that, weather permitting, I’ll be able to put this thing in the water next weekend.

 

LaLi

Well-Known Member
Let me know what you think.
The sheet hanging between the boom blocks looks a bit... dangerous :confused:

Solution:
I’d put 2 loops of duct tape around the lower boom and run the sheet thru the loops. That will keep the sheet from catching around your hat or your neck when you tack or gybe.
Rope loops will do, too, as will just about any flexible material. Whatever you use, adjust their length so that they only barely touch (or rather, don't touch) the tensioned sheet.

Also, the tiller extension looks very short. That topic was last discussed here: New Tiller Extension Length

The halyard/vang and the head and clew look fine now :rolleyes: (But I wouldn't glue any knots!)

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Last edited:

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
The sheet hanging between the boom blocks looks a bit... dangerous :confused:

Solution:Rope loops will do, too, as will just about any flexible material. Whatever you use, adjust their length so that they only barely touch (or rather, don't touch) the tensioned sheet.

Also, the tiller extension looks very short. That topic was last discussed here: New Tiller Extension Length

The halyard/vang and the head and clew look fine now :rolleyes: (But I wouldn't glue any knots!)

_
I have a plan for the hanging sheet, I just have to order the stuff. I'll be doing that tonight.

Tiller extension can wait until I see if I'm into sailing or not. This one just has to get me by for now.

Got the glue idea from Alan Glos in a previous thread. He does that to keep them from coming undone.

Regarding capsize. Have a centerboard retainer to keep the board in the trunk
Isn't that what the rope is for? It's just short enough that if the daggerboard were to try to escape in a turtle situation, it wouldn't be able to come out of the trunk all the way. That's what it seems like when I try to put it out with the rope attached anyway. I did discover though that the rope in question is sliced almost all the way through in one section, so I'll probably need to replace that with something.
 

Breeze Bender

Breeze Bender
Don’t wait for sheet hangers to be delivered. Use any old piece of line for your daggerboard. That boat is dying to get wet!
 

shorefun

Active Member
YIKES!!!!!

NO epoxy on the square knots!!!!!

Get smaller diameter line for holding the sail to the booms. That is too thick. You also need to get more gap between the boom and the sail. The smaller diameter line for the sail ties will hold a square knot better too.

The main halyard is the wrong type and diameter line. I see a lot of people using the thicker line but that likely makes it harder to raise.

My suggestion. Dont be that cheap with the boat. Shoreline Sailboats in NY sells the Vanguard line kit for $28. You get the correct lines for your main sheet and your halyard. Plus the lines for tying off the 2 ends of the sail. They will also sell you line for correctly tying the sail or the plastic pieces and the S hook for the front. You might need to spend $35 or $40 to get everything right and it does work better.

My sons fish had the wrong lines on it and it got easier to raise the sail after changing to correct lines.

It cost $6 for a couple of main sheet to boom loops that keep the sheet from trying to hang you. Yes, I got caught once.

Once you fix all those issues with the right parts the sunfish will be easier to manage.
Honestly, if you do nothing your boat will like sail ok, but do it right and it will likely be easier to manage and more enjoyable to sail often.
 
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Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
YIKES!!!!!

NO epoxy on the square knots!!!!!
The epoxy idea came from this very forum. Who do I believe?
1623702050458.png
Get smaller diameter line for holding the sail to the booms. That is too thick. You also need to get more gap between the boom and the sail. The smaller diameter line for the sail ties will hold a square knot better too.
The sail is mainly being held in with sail clip rings. You're saying that's not creating enough of a gap? Are sail rings not the right size? I'm so confused.

The main halyard is the wrong type and diameter line. I see a lot of people using the thicker line but that likely makes it harder to raise.

My suggestion. Dont be that cheap with the boat. Shoreline Sailboats in NY sells the Vanguard line kit for $28. You get the correct lines for your main sheet and your halyard. Plus the lines for tying off the 2 ends of the sail. They will also sell you line for correctly tying the sail or the plastic pieces and the S hook for the front. You might need to spend $35 or $40 to get everything right and it does work better.

My sons fish had the wrong lines on it and it got easier to raise the sail after changing to correct lines.

It cost $6 for a couple of main sheet to boom loops that keep the sheet from trying to hang you. Yes, I got caught once.

Once you fix all those issues with the right parts the sunfish will be easier to manage.
Honestly, if you do nothing your boat will like sail ok, but do it right and it will likely be easier to manage and more enjoyable to sail often.
My main halyard is pretty thin as far as the diameter goes. Are you confusing my halyard with my mainsheet? In fact, this might be the original halyard that came with this sunfish.
 

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
As Breeze Bender said get out sailing. There are always tweaks and adjustments to do and there always will be. You will never sail if you wait. You have lots of lakes to explore in upstate ny.
No worries, the only thing that's going to stop me this weekend are gusty winds or a failed launch. I'm all in.
 
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shorefun

Active Member
The halyard is just regular rope and it is too thick. Lines used on a sail boat will have a smooth coating. The rope you have will catch more and not let you pull it tight. I have seen various ropes and oversized lines used on the many Sunfish at the club and I can see people struggling with them. For $28 you get the correct lines plus some outhaul lines.

Next, the square knots. I have an opti and my sons Sunfish both held on with like 3mm line all with just plain old square knots and not a drip of epoxy. The reason why people use the lines is to adjust the sail for competition. They trust them with no epoxy, you should too.

BUT

Honestly the line you are using to hold the ends and the sail are too thick. It is much harder tying good knots with thicker line on smaller diameter things. The kit comes with the line that is used at the back ends of the booms which what I see in your video looks too thick.

The tack part of the sail is normally held in by an S hook. Again here you are trying to use too thick a line to tie it cleanly. The S hook is cheap.

The dagger board is a problem. If you flip it the dagger board could come out. That is why they use a long elastic cord with 2 brummel hooks to the bow handle. This pulls pressure on the dagger board. It wont come out if you flip it and when you go down wind you pull the dagger board out some and it will hold its position. If you buy the line kit buy the 2 brummel hooks.

I would also run the main sheet through the thing on the deck. It will be more comfortable in the long run. That is how my sons boat is rigged. My new to me boat I put on a main sheet swivel block that has the ratchet and found that to be even more comfortable, but is not required.

So what you have will work. But I am giving you my recommendations based on experience I seem to be gaining pretty fast. I am helping others in the club with their boats.

You want advice from someone that now has some experience.
Do this for ease of use.

Buy the Vanguard line kit from Shoreline, 2 brummels, an S hook, and the missing sail rings. Get the Vanguard directions online for putting the sail together to get the right knots.
Run the mainsheet through the block on top the deck.
As and extra buy the correct mainsheet snap. I think you can get them at Ace hardware in stainless.

That is not very much money and will give you a lot of pay back in ease of sail operation.

If you do nothing else, you really should do this:
The main halyard is wrong, get the correct type of line and size of line.
You need a bungee type line to hold the dagger board in position. This is a safety issue if it turtles.
Square knots will hold as is and I can assure you all the racers are using them, if they don't then the line is not the correct size for the application. You need smaller line.

Do you have this? https://static1.squarespace.com/static/59ce959ca9db091109b4eff0/t/5b840bf9032be4d68a5282ff/1535380474027/sunfish.pdf
 

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
The halyard is just regular rope and it is too thick. Lines used on a sail boat will have a smooth coating. The rope you have will catch more and not let you pull it tight. I have seen various ropes and oversized lines used on the many Sunfish at the club and I can see people struggling with them. For $28 you get the correct lines plus some outhaul lines.
Honestly the line you are using to hold the ends and the sail are too thick. It is much harder tying good knots with thicker line on smaller diameter things. The kit comes with the line that is used at the back ends of the booms which what I see in your video looks too thick.
I dunno man, that's what it came with. But sure, I can replace the halyard...at some point. Until then, the sail raises just fine, I can get it to the top just fine and it seems tight enough for now.

As far as my outhaul lines go, I bought these.


It's 4mm. Which is exactly what the line guide says to use, so I don't know how you can say they're too thick.

1623708832664.png


Next, the square knots. I have an opti and my sons Sunfish both held on with like 3mm line all with just plain old square knots and not a drip of epoxy. The reason why people use the lines is to adjust the sail for competition. They trust them with no epoxy, you should too.
Fair enough, I won't epoxy them unless I have an issue with them coming loose.

The tack part of the sail is normally held in by an S hook. Again here you are trying to use too thick a line to tie it cleanly. The S hook is cheap.
Did the S hook thing, it doesn't work with the sails from intensity. There's too much material at the tack and the S-hook can't clear it. I posted about it here and it was suggested that I just use some line, so I used some of the 4mm line I had left from the outhauls. If you think it's too thick, I have plenty of this 1mm robline, so let me know and I'll use that instead.

The dagger board is a problem. If you flip it the dagger board could come out. That is why they use a long elastic cord with 2 brummel hooks to the bow handle. This pulls pressure on the dagger board. It wont come out if you flip it and when you go down wind you pull the dagger board out some and it will hold its position. If you buy the line kit buy the 2 brummel hooks.
I don't see how it could come out of the trunk if the line tying it to the boat is shorter than the daggerboard is long. The line should go tight before the end of the daggerboard is able to clear the trunk. But fair enough, at some point I can upgrade to the bungie line with the brummel hooks, but again, I don't even know if I like sailing and this is all just to get me into the water and find out. If it turns out I love it, I can spring for these upgrades, but as it is, I've already dumped probably $1500 into this endeavor (the boat was only $100, keep in mind), so I'm gun shy about dropping anymore money into this until I know for sure I'm into it.

I would also run the main sheet through the thing on the deck. It will be more comfortable in the long run. That is how my sons boat is rigged. My new to me boat I put on a main sheet swivel block that has the ratchet and found that to be even more comfortable, but is not required.
I was told that as a beginner, I should just use the hook and not the block. That way if I get in trouble I can just let the sheet out and it won't be locked in.

So what you have will work. But I am giving you my recommendations based on experience I seem to be gaining pretty fast. I am helping others in the club with their boats.

You want advice from someone that now has some experience.
Do this for ease of use.

Buy the Vanguard line kit from Shoreline, 2 brummels, an S hook, and the missing sail rings. Get the Vanguard directions online for putting the sail together to get the right knots.
Run the mainsheet through the block on top the deck.
As and extra buy the correct mainsheet snap. I think you can get them at Ace hardware in stainless.

That is not very much money and will give you a lot of pay back in ease of sail operation.

If you do nothing else, you really should do this:
The main halyard is wrong, get the correct type of line and size of line.
You need a bungee type line to hold the dagger board in position. This is a safety issue if it turtles.
Square knots will hold as is and I can assure you all the racers are using them, if they don't then the line is not the correct size for the application. You need smaller line.

Do you have this? https://static1.squarespace.com/static/59ce959ca9db091109b4eff0/t/5b840bf9032be4d68a5282ff/1535380474027/sunfish.pdf
Fair enough. Some things I can do if I decide to keep sailing. That PDF you provided is the exact manual I used to rig this thing along with suggestions I've gathered here.
 
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