Tacktic

S

Skipper Johnson

New Member
Has anyone used this - is it any good?

Also - Is there any downside to buying a compass? By this I mean, will this hinder my progress by relying on equipment rather than feel etc?
 
My personal view is you should learn to sail using feel first. Compass should come in later when you want exact degree of the course. Relying too much on equipment when make you dependent on them.

For dinghy race course, I don't really see the need for compass cos usually you should be able to see the mark/buoy. Unless you are the first boat, else you should be following the leader.

However, for yacht race course, compass is definitely important cos you will be out in the open sea with no landmark will be available at certain point of time... and you only got your navigation map to help you sail towards your destination. In the open sea, the horizon is all sea... you will not know which direction your bow is pointing.... It is a big maze...
 
Skipper Johnson said:
Has anyone used this - is it any good?

Also - Is there any downside to buying a compass? By this I mean, will this hinder my progress by relying on equipment rather than feel etc?
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Is the Tacktick a digital compass? Rule 22 of the ILCA Rules says that electronic and digital compasses are prohibited.

As far as an analog compass goes, I have one, and it doesn't inhibit my progress, but it doesn't help me much yet either. I'm too busy with everything else that needs to be done to look at it, so far. I hope to spend some time this year with practice in using it to see whether I'm lifted or headed. It did help when I sailed at Masters MWE because the first mark, at half a mile, was so far away you couldn't see it easily.
 
Merrily said:
Is the Tacktick a digital compass? Rule 22 of the ILCA Rules says that electronic and digital compasses are prohibited.

As far as an analog compass goes, I have one, and it doesn't inhibit my progress, but it doesn't help me much yet either. I'm too busy with everything else that needs to be done to look at it, so far. I hope to spend some time this year with practice in using it to see whether I'm lifted or headed. It did help when I sailed at Masters MWE because the first mark, at half a mile, was so far away you couldn't see it easily.
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Thanks for the feedback re the electronic compass. I thought the compass might help with me headers / lifters. On a lake navigating to the next buoy is not an issue. But what I do find confusing when beating is:

1) I know when I am headed, but should I tack straight away? What seems to happen on the lake is the wind almost immediately shifts back and when I go about Im headed on the next tack! Double whammy.

2) I can be on a header but maybe I was sailing above the median prior and the "header" is really just taking me back to the median. I can't see how, without a compass, I could detect this.

Cheerio
 
Skipper Johnson said:
Thanks for the feedback re the electronic compass. I thought the compass might help with me headers / lifters. On a lake navigating to the next buoy is not an issue. But what I do find confusing when beating is:

1) I know when I am headed, but should I tack straight away? What seems to happen on the lake is the wind almost immediately shifts back and when I go about Im headed on the next tack! Double whammy.

2) I can be on a header but maybe I was sailing above the median prior and the "header" is really just taking me back to the median. I can't see how, without a compass, I could detect this.

Cheerio
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1. On our gusty lake, full of cats paws, too, I've heard to count to ten before tacking when headed, because of these quick shifts.

2. I didn't say it wasn't useful! I'm just not skilled enough to get it all done yet. Watching for gusts, right sail shape and keeping the telltales flying right, using body weight to steer, tactics, the mysteries of strategy--it's a lot to take in for a newbie. However, one accomplished sailor at my club doesn't use a compass. He sights stuff on the shoreline to tell if he's headed, at the median, etc. That is a skill in itself, and it seems like the compass would be easier.
 
As Merrily has pointed out, electronic and digital compasses (including those on your watch!) are illegal. Lots of people ask why since you can get them so cheaply now and the answer is that they seem to all include tactical functions along with the compass. I suppose its a fine line in what you call "tactical" (e.g. Silva compasses with the numbers which read the same, theoretically, on each tack) but that is the hurdle. The oft repeated statement from Ian Lineberger (our Prez) is that if they will make a straight electronic/digital compass with no tactical functions then the class would propose a rule change to allow them.

I sail mostly in the ocean or along the coast with onshore breezes which, since they don't come off the land, are typically quite stable in direction. As a result, my first experiences on lakes were really quite entertaining. I'll save you the years of learning stories... my only suggestion is to get a really good book on the subject. To me personally, the very best book I have ever read on wind shifts is "Positioning: The Logic of Sailboat Racing" by Stuart Walker. While I find most of Stuart Walker's books rather opaque on the theory end, and a bit too anecdotal on the "I lost the Fall Salad Bowl because I tacked when I should have kept going" or something, this book is really different. He breaks conditions into three categories (oscillating, one side obviously favored, none of the above), describes how to determine which category you are in, then describes the high probability strategies for each category. While there don't seem (to me) to be any exact rules in sailing, what he offers in this book is a great foundation and has certainly helped me to stop doing the obviously (to everyone else) wrong things.

Having typed this I am sure others will also have their favorite sources of info...
 
Merrily said:
1. On our gusty lake, full of cats paws, too, I've heard to count to ten before tacking when headed, because of these quick shifts.

2. I didn't say it wasn't useful! I'm just not skilled enough to get it all done yet. Watching for gusts, right sail shape and keeping the telltales flying right, using body weight to steer, tactics, the mysteries of strategy--it's a lot to take in for a newbie. However, one accomplished sailor at my club doesn't use a compass. He sights stuff on the shoreline to tell if he's headed, at the median, etc. That is a skill in itself, and it seems like the compass would be easier.
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I hear you girlfriend!
 
Having typed this I am sure others will also have their favorite sources of info...[/quote]

Ta muchly. and thanks to merrile re the count to 10 thing. This might help. See, I thought I should tack straight away but on reflection I think what I should be looking for is a more permament shift. Our lake, especially when it's light winds, can be a nightmare. Example on Saturday - I was on a dead run, a guy from directly ahead was also on a dead run coming toward me! Nuts!
 
Skipper Johnson said:
Our lake, especially when it's light winds, can be a nightmare. Example on Saturday - I was on a dead run, a guy from directly ahead was also on a dead run coming toward me! Nuts!
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Yeah, and we're both yelling, "Starboard!" The bigger boat won. His.
 
SFBayLaser said:
To me personally, the very best book I have ever read on wind shifts is "Positioning: The Logic of Sailboat Racing" by Stuart Walker. ..
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Well, SFBayLaser recommended the video "Hot Yachts, Cold Water" to me, and it is excellent, so I thought I'd give this book a look-see. I've been saving my pennies lately, and so looked for it at a library. I found it, but not locally, through a university library and it is on its way. Then, just out of curiosity, I looked it up on Amazon. $149.99!!! It's even more at ALibris. It's out of print, but still--

That must be some book. Can't wait.
 
Merrily said:
Well, SFBayLaser recommended the video "Hot Yachts, Cold Water" to me, and it is excellent, so I thought I'd give this book a look-see. I've been saving my pennies lately, and so looked for it at a library. I found it, but not locally, through a university library and it is on its way. Then, just out of curiosity, I looked it up on Amazon. $149.99!!! It's even more at ALibris. It's out of print, but still--

That must be some book. Can't wait.
Click to expand...

Wait! I googled it and found it for $29.99 at two places.
 
Merrily said:
Is the Tacktick a digital compass? Rule 22 of the ILCA Rules says that electronic and digital compasses are prohibited.

As far as an analog compass goes, I have one, and it doesn't inhibit my progress, but it doesn't help me much yet either. I'm too busy with everything else that needs to be done to look at it, so far. I hope to spend some time this year with practice in using it to see whether I'm lifted or headed. It did help when I sailed at Masters MWE because the first mark, at half a mile, was so far away you couldn't see it easily.
Click to expand...

Which compass do you have Mezza? And are you happy with it? Can you recommend any others etc etc
 
Skipper Johnson said:
Which compass do you have Mezza? And are you happy with it? Can you recommend any others etc etc
Click to expand...

Mezza? Is this like "tinnies?" I googled Mezza and came up with "small appetizers," "emu oil," or a website about the fear of gelatin.

Anyway, I have a Nexus 103R compass. I slides onto a bracket on my deck, and it has tactical numbers on it which seem harder to me to use than one with degrees. I got the compass thrown into the deal when I bought a Europe Dinghy last winter. (Note to self, stop buying boats in the winter.) See the bottom of this page:
http://www.apsltd.com/Tree/d3000/e1872.asp
 
Merrily said:
Mezza? Is this like "tinnies?" I googled Mezza and came up with "small appetizers," "emu oil," or a website about the fear of gelatin.

Anyway, I have a Nexus 103R compass. I slides onto a bracket on my deck, and it has tactical numbers on it which seem harder to me to use than one with degrees. I got the compass thrown into the deal when I bought a Europe Dinghy last winter. (Note to self, stop buying boats in the winter.) See the bottom of this page:
http://www.apsltd.com/Tree/d3000/e1872.asp
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Thanks. Along with adding the "ee" sound to the end of things, we also like to shorten espcially people's names and add za on the end.

eg Sharons are Shezzas, Barry becomes Bazza, Terry is a Tezza and Merrily becomes Mezza
 
Skipper Johnson said:
Thanks. Along with adding the "ee" sound to the end of things, we also like to shorten espcially people's names and add za on the end.
eg Sharons are Shezzas, Barry becomes Bazza, Terry is a Tezza and Merrily becomes Mezza
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Thank you for the second lesson in speaking Aussie. :)
 
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