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Old Laser Hull 823 pics

4bdennis

New Member
Took a bunch of pictures today
 

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4bdennis

New Member
More
 

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4bdennis

New Member
Inside the hull
 

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Rob Hair

Active Member
Of special interest to me are the spacers under the upper gudgeon. My hull (#555) has the same thing.
 

4bdennis

New Member
The spacer looked like a cost saving measure. I removed the upper and lower gudgeons to seal the air leaks after a bubble test and compared the two . They appear to be the same .
 

Rob Hair

Active Member
I think the spacers are necessary to get the right clearance to the aft edge of the deck. Also without the spacers the rudder rake (angle to horizontal) is different. If I remember correctly, with the spacers the rudder rake was about the same as on a newer Laser I previously owned which had plastic gudeons.

I made some careful measurements of all this year's ago and might even be able to find what I recorded back then. :)
 

Rob Hair

Active Member
I'm happy to see another hull with what appears to be exactly the same spacers as mine. Wonder if all Lasers with a hull number below ??? were from the same builder.
 

LaLi

Well-Known Member
:eek: Wow, there's so much to comment on, thank you for posting all that! I have to take some time now for research :D

Wonder if all Lasers with a hull number below ??? were from the same builder.
Most Lasers were technically from the same builder until 1983, when the trademark was split between the de facto different builders in different countries (some, at least the Japanese one, had been independent earlier). But between March 1971 and April 1972 all boats actually came from Montreal. The gudgeon spacers were probably used everywhere, though, until the change to the current plastic fittings in about 1976.

_
 

LaLi

Well-Known Member
PXL_20210412_121958080.jpg

This mast step has clearly been repaired/reinforced, and it looks like a clean and good job. One less thing to worry about.


PXL_20210412_122037335.jpg

Riveting into fibreglass should be outlawed :confused: But no problem if this doesn't leak.


PXL_20210412_122448730.jpg

So the original vang blocks have been even more original! The lack of lightening holes on the cleat block complicates installing more purchase, but I'll think of something :D

The line looks clean and new. How thick is it? Did you do the splice yourself?


PXL_20210412_122453759.jpg

This is interesting. I faintly remember that someone had a vang tang like that on a very old boat, and everyone said Lasers never had that type of fitting there! It's obviously original though, as it's made by Custom Fittings Canada, which was located not far from Montreal and supplied apparently all of the stainless parts on early Lasers.

The most important single change I would make to the whole boat would be to change that quick-link to a swivel. Makes a world of difference. How wide is that strap at its middle point?


PXL_20210412_122631775.jpg

Yeah, that's apparently the original location of the vang key fitting. No problem with that.


PXL_20210412_122700456.jpg

It's interesting that only the upper gudgeon had the spacer. I understand this was the case with all boats with the stainless fittings. One would imagine this would cause the rudder to be angled slightly differently than on the plastic-gudgeon boats. But let's wait for Rob's numbers :D

More to come...

_
 

4bdennis

New Member
I did the mast step last week after reading of a few horror stories of ripped out decks.
The drain plug passed the bubble test.
The rope is 1/4 sta-set, yes I did the splice. This thicker rope works better than the blue rope I had earlier.
The vang strap is 3/8 in the middle. Still need to order a swivel.
Thank you all for help discovering and decoding 823
 

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LaLi

Well-Known Member
PXL_20210412_124146813.jpg

Interesting that there's no hole in the centreboard top forward corner, but a separate fairlead. If you want to make one, it's 10 mm in diameter, and its centre is 25 mm from both edges.


PXL_20210412_124052071.jpg PXL_20210412_124046781.jpg

At first it ooks like the blade goes too far down - the rule of thumb is that the topmost part of the trailing edge should be parallel with the aft edge of the rudder head. But comparing that to my rudders, it seems like the blade profile isn't quite the same either! The small corner on the trailing edge near the waterline is clearly even smaller here.

I'd put the downhaul cleat on the side of the tiller (and a bit more forward maybe) so the line wouldn't have to bend around like that. No big deal though.

Would like to see more of that tiller, and the homebuilt extension! What length(s) did you choose?


PXL_20210412_123107255.jpg

That's within the tolerances :D


PXL_20210412_123002543.jpg

So you want to update the sheet cleats. Are the old Ficos junk?


PXL_20210412_122729120.jpg

This is one thing you really want to change! Have you already looked at different choices for a ratchet block?

(Get a centreboard brake,too.)


PXL_20210406_205148464.jpg

Any plans for restoring the original shade? (I'm no expert on that, but there should be others on this forum who are.)

_
 

4bdennis

New Member
Homemade walnut tiller handle and extension.
The extension is 36 inches of some aluminum tubing I had around and the connection is rope and knot . I am still experimenting with it's length. I epoxied a piece of stainless light switch cover to the bottom of the tiller handle to stop the wood from being compressed when in the rudder head. This setup worked well this past Sunday except the extension was too long so I shortened it to it's present length
 

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4bdennis

New Member
PXL_20210412_124146813.jpg

Interesting that there's no hole in the centreboard top forward corner, but a separate fairlead. If you want to make one, it's 10 mm in diameter, and its centre is 25 mm from both edges.


PXL_20210412_124052071.jpg PXL_20210412_124046781.jpg

At first it ooks like the blade goes too far down - the rule of thumb is that the topmost part of the trailing edge should be parallel with the aft edge of the rudder head. But comparing that to my rudders, it seems like the blade profile isn't quite the same either! The small corner on the trailing edge near the waterline is clearly even smaller here.

I'd put the downhaul cleat on the side of the tiller (and a bit more forward maybe) so the line wouldn't have to bend around like that. No big deal though.

Would like to see more of that tiller, and the homebuilt extension! What length(s) did you choose?


PXL_20210412_123107255.jpg

That's within the tolerances :D


PXL_20210412_123002543.jpg

So you want to update the sheet cleats. Are the old Ficos junk?


PXL_20210412_122729120.jpg

This is one thing you really want to change! Have you already looked at different choices for a ratchet block?

(Get a centreboard brake,too.)


PXL_20210406_205148464.jpg

Any plans for restoring the original shade? (I'm no expert on that, but there should be others on this forum who are.)

_
 

4bdennis

New Member
PXL_20210412_124146813.jpg

Interesting that there's no hole in the centreboard top forward corner, but a separate fairlead. If you want to make one, it's 10 mm in diameter, and its centre is 25 mm from both edges.


PXL_20210412_124052071.jpg PXL_20210412_124046781.jpg

At first it ooks like the blade goes too far down - the rule of thumb is that the topmost part of the trailing edge should be parallel with the aft edge of the rudder head. But comparing that to my rudders, it seems like the blade profile isn't quite the same either! The small corner on the trailing edge near the waterline is clearly even smaller here.

I'd put the downhaul cleat on the side of the tiller (and a bit more forward maybe) so the line wouldn't have to bend around like that. No big deal though.

Would like to see more of that tiller, and the homebuilt extension! What length(s) did you choose?


PXL_20210412_123107255.jpg

That's within the tolerances :D


PXL_20210412_123002543.jpg

So you want to update the sheet cleats. Are the old Ficos junk?


PXL_20210412_122729120.jpg

This is one thing you really want to change! Have you already looked at different choices for a ratchet block?

(Get a centreboard brake,too.)


PXL_20210406_205148464.jpg

Any plans for restoring the original shade? (I'm no expert on that, but there should be others on this forum who are.)

_
I preemptively ordered a deck hardware kit.When I went to update the cam cleats I found the new ones where a different size.
Agree the mainsheet block will be updated.
I made the new hiking strap from doubled up seatbelt webbing and stuffed it with some of the old mainsheet.
Later on I would like to bring the vibrant orange back .
 

LaLi

Well-Known Member
Homemade walnut tiller
Beautiful!

I epoxied a piece of stainless light switch cover to the bottom of the tiller handle to stop the wood from being compressed when in the rudder head.
Smart.

The extension is 36 inches ... This setup worked well this past Sunday except the extension was too long so I shortened it to it's present length
You should have posted about this on Sunday so I could have told you to not shorten anything :confused:

36 in is about 91 cm. The next standard length up is 107 cm (42 in), which I think is the absolute shortest you can get away with... my own extension is 120, and quite a few sail with a 130. I think the numbers speak for themselves :rolleyes:

_
 

Rob Hair

Active Member
It's interesting that only the upper gudgeon had the spacer. I understand this was the case with all boats with the stainless fittings. One would imagine this would cause the rudder to be angled slightly differently than on the plastic-gudgeon boats. But let's wait for Rob's numbers :D
I found the measurements I took years ago comparing my #555 to what was then also my #116810 (since sold). There is close to an inch difference between the rudder positions measured at the lowest point. However, if the rudder sits a bit differently in the head in original vs newer rudders as the above photos suggest, that may compensate.

I'll redo my drawing to make it more legible and send a photo of my rudder when I get a chance.

This seeming difference bothered me at the time, considering the care the class takes to keep boats standardized. I didn't know, though, if the spacers were something someone just added to my boat. That's certainly not the case, since those spacers seem to be made from the same unusual material as mine.
 

Rob Hair

Active Member
I just realized my comment about the rudder position in the head compensating is wrong - makes difference greater. :)
 

Rob Hair

Active Member
PXL_20210412_122700456.jpg

It's interesting that only the upper gudgeon had the spacer. I understand this was the case with all boats with the stainless fittings. One would imagine this would cause the rudder to be angled slightly differently than on the plastic-gudgeon boats. But let's wait for Rob's numbers :D

Here is a sketch showing what I measured on two boats I have owned, hull #555 and #116810. I've since sold 116810. Distance A is from the mast hole to the rod tip and B is from the mast hole to the aft edge of the deck.

Concerning the uniformity of the boats over the years, the spacer under the gudgeon or its omission on later boats does make a small difference in the position of the rudder. It's about an inch difference at the tip, but I'd expect the effect on the sailing of the boat to be quite a bit more than the markings on hardware, etc. ;)


IMG_20210419_165331.jpg


This shows the rudder from #555.

IMG_20210415_163635.jpgIMG_20210415_163910.jpg
 

Laserupstateny

New Member
I have what I believe is a 1973 Laser in navy blue. The hull has the same spacers on the top gudgeon and surprised me since I thought that the stern was perfectly level and would not require such things. The number under the bow hook of mine is #4,007.
 

Riv

Active Member
How were the wooden rudder and board made so identical? To get the cross section all the same?
 
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