Iraq?

Discussion in 'Laser Talk' started by Goonie, Nov 5, 2002.

  1. Goonie

    Goonie Guest

    What do you guys believe should be done with Iraq? Me personally I do not believe it would be right to attack Iraq. If anyone is intrested I will tell you why not! What do you guys think?

    Seth
     
  2. macwas16

    macwas16 New Member

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    ok first off your canadian, not american. lol. this is our mess thats been around for years. it has to be taken control of or with the touch of a button could blow up washington. as well as many other inosent lives. with our technology and experience it wouldn't be a long war or "conflict" as our despute 10 years ago was called. we'll kick his ass in a few weeks just like bin laden!!
     
  3. Bradley

    Bradley Administrator Staff Member

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    I feel strongly that we should take out Iraq and Suddam! The reasons are much longer than I could type here.
     
  4. macwas16

    macwas16 New Member

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    yeah deffinately but why is this in the juniors forum??
     
  5. Bradley

    Bradley Administrator Staff Member

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    who knows?
     
  6. CDN Sailor

    CDN Sailor New Member

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    "ok first off your canadian, not american. lol. this is our mess thats been around for years. it has to be taken control of or with the touch of a button could blow up washington. as well as many other inosent lives. with our technology and experience it wouldn't be a long war or "conflict" as our despute 10 years ago was called. we'll kick his ass in a few weeks just like bin laden!!"

    First of all the invasion of countries under the mask of a "fight for the right" which is actually just a fight for oil is everyone's business. That's why organizations, let's say the UN, are made so that no one country can decide the future of another. Sure the UN has its downfalls but it works in principle.

    Second of all how could Iraq attack American soil? Tony Blair said that by 2010 Iraq could have weapons to reach the edges of Europe. Yes with your "superior" technology you were able to bomb civilians in wars with so called smart bombs, and with your superior experience in stepping into other countries business to save your interests, oh whoops i forgot it's actually for the good of the people in the other country my mistake.

    Yes I'm sure you will get Suddam just like you got bin Laden. Oh wait you haven't caught bin Laden yet. I seem to be forgetting a lot of things haven't I. Silly me.

    And to Bradley what are all these good reasons? I'm sure there are alot of good reasons to invade Iraq. They are however not what the American governments says they are. And just to finish my spiel off, I am not an anti-american. I am just against Americans who think everything in the world is a a black and white situation.
     
  7. Goonie

    Goonie Guest

    I posted A VERY LONG REPLY, but it didn't get sent in. there go 30 mins of typing :(!!!!!!!!!
     
  8. macwas16

    macwas16 New Member

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    this is what i mean. why do people just have to be argumentative? what was the point of CDN sailor's post? it surely didn't help the mood and it only applies negative energy which is one thing that i think bradley could agree on that we dont here. THERE are reasons for attaching iraq and there are good ones too that the CIA wont tell us. so please lets state opinions and please try to be accepting to diff. points of view.
     
  9. Bradley

    Bradley Administrator Staff Member

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    thanks mackenzie, I don't mind a nice debate though. Its nice not to talk about the forum for once and talk about issues....

    Here is how I think of the situtation:
    If WE do destroy the Iraqi government and leaders and he does have nuclear weapons, and we know he has chemical weapons, then we have saved many causalties of innocent civilians in the US and Britian.

    If we are wrong and he doesn't then we have one dead god aweful dictator.

    Also here is my other theory:
    You say "how is he going to get them here"

    Well how was little ole Afghanistan going to "get them here"?
    They are even smaller than Iraq and didn't have much trouble with it.

    A good discription of what we must do to protect our country is protect our:
    Borders, Laugauge, culture

    Also, don't believe everything you read in the paper or on TV. Check multiple sources. Also a great resource In my oppinion is Talk Radio. My favortite shows are Sean Hannity ( www.hannity.com), Neal Boortz ( www.wsbradio.com ), and Mike Savage.
     
  10. Goonie

    Goonie Guest

    This is good healthy debate mac. It is not negative. I will re type my post later.

    SEth
     
  11. Bradley

    Bradley Administrator Staff Member

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    o yeah seth, whenever i write a long post I copy it to the clip board just in case i Have more than 3 smillies in a row or something crazy like that that deletes my entire post...
     
  12. CDN Sailor

    CDN Sailor New Member

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    to mac
    what do you mean "what was the point of my post" the point was to start meaningful discussion so as not to have a post of. Let's get iraq. Yes i agree. that is the only way.
    i was not trying to be negative. i was trying to open discussion on a very important topic.

    part of debating is debating both sides so as to get all the facts.
    i agree i was too sarcastic and i apologize.
     
  13. Bradley

    Bradley Administrator Staff Member

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    Just a little plug for the forum:
    If you did this on the mailing list you would likely get kicked off for discussing non-laser issues. The benefit of our forum is to create a Laser Community Forum with a group (hopefully large) of people that regularly check the forum and participate in the threads that interest them. I am working on some cool contest with REAL giveaways....Stay tuned.
     
  14. CDN Sailor

    CDN Sailor New Member

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    Just to stirr up some controversy:

    Bradley you say that the attack on iraq is a win/win situation.
    But under that assumption shouldn't countries be invading the US? You said countries should fight for their borders language and culture. Wouldn't you say that the US is impressing their way of life on other countries?
    Can you really call the US a democracy when 30-35% of the people vote and only 47% of the people who did voted wanted the government. Where only the rich get good healthcare?
    I think not.

    NOTE: I'm not trying to say that countries should actually be invading others. What i'm trying to do is to get people who I think, and this is just my opinion, have a very narrow minded education system, to start asking questions. If people jsut follow what the government says and not think about what is actually happening then it is no different than a dictatorship.
     
  15. Bradley

    Bradley Administrator Staff Member

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    Ok When i say borders, language, culture, I am reffering to USA not any other countries. We must protect out borders from illegal aliens, perserve our language and our culture and not let it be poluted by others. This isn't a black vs. white thing this is a is the classic Western world vs. the Eastern world. This has been happening for thousands of years. The westerners change with the times while the easterners are still stuck back in time. We mustn't go back in time.

    Second, the United States is not really a Democracy it is a Republic. Even the presidential ellection doesn't really count as the electoral guy for that state could cast the vote for the other candidate (not likely but possible). So really although many people call the United States a democracy we are not really a full democracy. We are more like a republic.
     
  16. macwas16

    macwas16 New Member

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    my appologies CDN sailor. i did not think we were starting a debate and i was still a bit anxious over the laser forum constitution. i was simply trying to say hey lets not get off on the wrong foot here. but now and on a sitiuation like this dabates are good.

    Sudam must be killed is my opinion. he is doing nothing good for anyone and is just brainwashing inoccent lives. this world needs no more violence and he is only instigating previou problems.
     
  17. CDN Sailor

    CDN Sailor New Member

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    Bradley: Must other countries protect themselves from those 3 things as well? Why is the US so special that it has different rights. Why do you think they are "behind the times"?

    Mac: We are all brainwashed in some way Mac. We are all influenced by how we grow up. The only way to be truly not brainwashed is to live under a rock for a couple decades. In my opinion I think you have been brainwashed by America to think they are superior to others. You probably think I'm brainwashed. It's all perspective.

    p.s. I think suddam has to go, not nessacarily die. But don't agree with the US actions and motives.
     
  18. macwas16

    macwas16 New Member

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    ummm...k

    we haven't been brainwashed we've been victimized by terror
     
  19. Goonie

    Goonie Guest

    "“The status quo is not acceptable,” Bush said. “We have to make sure (Saddam’s ) 11 years of defiance” (of UN resolutions) do not go unanswered.”"

    Bush doesn't use this hard line against Israel who has been defying UN resolutions on settlements in the occupied territories for a VERY LONG time!

    Seth
     
  20. kwilson

    kwilson New Member

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    Here's a little story of something that happened to me about a year ago that I like to enlighten people with. This is a true story that happend to me :(


    WHERE WERE YOU ON SEPTEMBER 11........


    I was walking across One Plaza when the first plane hit. At first it was like it was not really happening.....twilight zone. Once I heard the explosion I started running over to broadway because there was a group of people that had gathered and were looking up I figured that there was something to see. At first you could'nt see anything only smoke; the buildings are so tall and we were so close that all we could see was smoke. Everyone was saying at first that a helicopter had hit the biulding....its much different than listening to the news media seeing it live, you don't get any info.

    I started up broadway to see if I could get a better view and thats when the cops really started pushing people to move uptown. As we started to move I heard a deep whistling sound and looked up just in time to see the 2nd tower just explode. The noise was paralyzing. At once people started to run frantically in a panic. I did'nt see the plane hit but I saw the explosion and the immediate aftermath. Once the initial plum of flame disipated debree started to rain; glass and metal fragments by the millions all over....everywhere. I tried to run but everytime I did I felt paralyzed by the sheer horror of what I was seeing. When I did manage to run you really don't make any distance, that's how big these building where.

    I managed to get to Ruby's across from the WS parking garage....were I was to meet a client. The place was packed with people trying to escape the raining of debree and get off the street to stay away from the hords of emergency personel and people in shock. As I was in the restuarant they had a TV on CNN at the bar.....everyone in the place was quite just watching; every few minutes something would happen...an explosion or a fire truck would cruz by blowing hard and you would feel it outside and see it with a delay on the TV....seareal. Then the first tower went. The people that were at the windows saw it live first and reacted imediatly....then the rest of the people watching the TV.....everyone was in absolute and total shock some people even ran outside. We could only see from the mid section up because of the biulding in front of us. A friend of mine that works at the Guardian on Water St was on the 22 floor watching it when it happened, I was on the phone with him when it went. It was bizarre listening to the people scream over his cel phone while he heard the people scream on my side. The vibration and sound that it made was awesome....in a bad way. A paraclestic cloud washed over lower Manhat. heading uptown engulfing everything in its path in hot ash and debri. We watched people out side running past just being swallowed and then it past us.....all fell silent like fresh snow on a winters night. A few people ran into the retaurant and you could immediatly smell the dust on them and the utter panic in there horror stricken voices. It was something I've never even witnessed in a film or in history.

    Then the second tower went and it all started over again. It took me 16 hours to get home and I only live 20 miles North of the city. I did'nt get my car out for two weeks. The Ferry ride over to Jersey City was like a ghost ride, it was the first time that anybody had seen a distance view, other than that of the TV. We all got a much closer view than we wanted.

    Three people on my block at home died. Two of them NYC Fireman....and I knew them all; one was a good friend. I see his wife and two little girls everyday. I will never forget the horror of that day.....unfortunetly.

    That's where I was on 9/11. :mad:


    When Saddam drops a nuclear weapon in your back yard and kills your friends and family, and changes the way you think about your families safety then we'll talk. But until then I support the full protection of our counrty by any means nessessary. Regardless of the political "oil" implications. :eek:



    k
     

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