Rigging pics and hiking style contrasts

49208

Tentmaker
The following show some interesting variation in hiking

First look at Anna T's hiking style and strap length - she's 5'7" so going from the toes isn't an option, but dang, she is hiking hard.
http://www.sailanna.com/images/IMG_0583.JPG
http://www.sailanna.com/images/IMG_0586.JPG


Next up, some rigging pics from JDE (the shockcord arrangement on the outhaul was interesting, first tension adjustable one I have come across), but also notice his comment on his hiking strap tie/length - quite a contrast from a shorter legged person
http://www.jdemarine.com/laser__rigging.htm
 

rock steady

New Member
Great links and pics 49208, thanks for posting.

Anna's hiking style is impressive and would take incredible thigh strength to hold for long, but I doubt it would be effective in variable conditions. How could you pull yourself inboard quickly in a knock or lull? Perhaps she is just applying this technique to short burst speed needs?
 

TimClark

New Member
I've tried it before, it makes the battens in the hiking pants feel more "engaged" and you can really feel them working well. But its really annoying to get into the boat.

Tim
 

gouvernail

Super Opinionated and Always Correct
I gotta believe straight leg hiking gives the best leverage and freedom of movement.
 
Her method is good for windy days, where you will be sustained hiking for long periods of time. Also, she is short and so would use that tecnique to get more weight out of the boat.
However, if you're tall enough, you should probably have the strap fairly tight and be strait-leg hiking. Strait-leg is more effective and correspondingly more tiring.
 

Merrily

Administrator
That drop seat hiking is only for people with iron knees. I can't believe she'll be able to sustain that after her 30's, but then she won't be contending for the Olympics then either.
 

Sarah B

New Member
Having partly bent knees means that you can extend your legs when hit by a gust or to react with waves.
If hiking with straight legs, does anyone find their hips end up hurting? My knees don't hurt with bent legs rather weirdly!
 

49208

Tentmaker
Sarah B said:
---snip---
If hiking with straight legs, does anyone find their hips end up hurting?

That sounds like tight hamstrings and/or hip flexors. I found increasing my flexibility even a small amount in those two areas helped prevent soreness and gave faster recovery from a days worth of hiking.

See Meka's advice here:
http://www.laserforum.org/showthread.php?t=3708
and check the 'net for more info.

I took a few yoga classes so I could get a better handle on proper stretching techniques - one think I learned in those was the length of time holding the stretch. I was typically holding up to 30 seconds prior to yoga - in those classes were were holding the stretch 1 to 2 minutes and once I was tuned into what was happening, I could feel the stretched muscles start to relax somewhere between 30 and 45 seconds and the distance I was stretching would increase an inch or more. Lesson learned - hold it until the muscle fatigues/relaxes and then start counting for at least another 30 seconds.
 

Sarah B

New Member
Thanks for the link. I used to ballet dance so have loads of bad stretching habits. Will try the yoga technique of more sustained stretches. Thanks!
 

chrisfsi

New Member
Interesting comments on the stretching technique - will try this. Going back to the JDE photos, from what I could see, the control lines seemed to cross between the blocks at the bottom of the mast and the cleats on the deck - ie, the line through the starboard block leads to the port cleat, and vice versa.
What's the logic here? Mine - and all the one's I've seen - go straight back - port block to port cleat, etc.

Anyone else do this?
 

Merrily

Administrator
chrisfsi said:
Interesting comments on the stretching technique - will try this. Going back to the JDE photos, from what I could see, the control lines seemed to cross between the blocks at the bottom of the mast and the cleats on the deck - ie, the line through the starboard block leads to the port cleat, and vice versa.
What's the logic here? Mine - and all the one's I've seen - go straight back - port block to port cleat, etc.

Anyone else do this?

Wow, your monitor must have way better resolution than mine. I cross my lines because I have an old compass with only one hole in the center. Crossing the lines greatly reduces the friction through that hole, and I'm too lazy to drill more holes when that seems to work just fine. Of course, there could be some other reason for crossing the lines in the JDE photos.
 

chrisfsi

New Member
Are we talking the same picture? I meant the JDE photos, not the Anna pics. The control lines are very clear in the first pic. The compass is well off centre, (which is intersting in itself), so I'm not sure if that is the reason.

I liked the comment about setting the compass in an upturned peanut butter lid, although he omitted to mention if it was smooth or crunchy. I think we need to know, these details make all the difference....:D

And isn't it a little early to be web surfing in Ohio?????
 

Merrily

Administrator
chrisfsi said:
And isn't it a little early to be web surfing in Ohio?????

Well, it's 8 a.m. now. I was up at 5:30. Couldn't sleep. I have a lot of stuff to do to get ready to go to a regatta tomorrow.
 
Merrily said:
That drop seat hiking is only for people with iron knees. I can't believe she'll be able to sustain that after her 30's, but then she won't be contending for the Olympics then either.

Actually, I was seeing a knee specialist recently (not for sailing; crashed in a ski race and tore and/or stretched almost every ligament in my knee-but that's another story) and he said the strongest position for your knee isn't strait, but slightly bent because there are more muscles engaged.
 

172334

New Member
Good fotoes, but I think that hiking on the such long strap may gain a not really good habit to sail on the heeled boat
 

TimClark

New Member
computeroman2 said:
Actually, I was seeing a knee specialist recently (not for sailing; crashed in a ski race and tore and/or stretched almost every ligament in my knee-but that's another story) and he said the strongest position for your knee isn't strait, but slightly bent because there are more muscles engaged.

It's just like using your elbow in archery...You don't want to have your knees locked, that will cause you to get really shaky and fatigue really easily. When people say straight-leg hiking, your knees are not actually locked straight, there is a little bend in the leg.
 

LPW

New Member
TimClark said:
You don't want to have your knees locked, that will cause you to get really shaky and fatigue really easily.

thanks for that tim- i thought my legs shaking after a period of straight legging was something unique to me:D . Never researched it though!
 

madyottie

Apprentice
I realise most of you will already have seen it but......
there's a really good article on the two types of hiking on Rooster's website. From memory I think Steve decided that bent leg gave you more leverage but straight leg gave more mobility and allows you to keep a laser flatter because your bum doesn't drag in the water:confused:


Great pic's tho! i won't comment on the rigging tho.
 

LPW

New Member
madyottie said:
I realise most of you will already have seen it but......
there's a really good article on the two types of hiking on Rooster's website. From memory I think Steve decided that bent leg gave you more leverage but straight leg gave more mobility and allows you to keep a laser flatter because your bum doesn't drag in the water:confused:


Great pic's tho! i won't comment on the rigging tho.
Dont you mean straight leg gives you more leverage but bent leg gives you more mobility and sore knees!
 

madyottie

Apprentice
OK, so I've just read the Rooster article again (it was probably over a year ago last time) and its not actually the article I was thinking of! I can definitely remember reading somewhere that the big advantage of straight leg hiking is that you are higher above the water. In order to maintain the straight leg position, most people position themselves with about equal deck loading on the calves and hammies, which gives maximum contact with the boat, hence the added mobility and increased ability to torque the boat over waves etc.
However, if you have relatively short legs you can get more weight further out by having a looser strap and pulling yourself further to windward, so most of the weight is on your calves. Basically your knee is at about the gunwhale somewhere.

I used to do this when I started racing lasers with full rig at age 14, and can say it certainly helped me when I was little. It did mean that I couldn't hold the boat as flat as the bigger guys or I'd be sitting in the water, but at least I could hold it up. When the gusts hit I could straighten my legs that little bit more, giving maximum leverage for a light guy, but obviously I couldn't hold this position for long before my quads started to tremble!

That said, it COULD be the reason I suffer from mildly annoying knee problems now, so I'll not recommend it!

If I find out what I read the original article in, I'll post it here for all to see!
 

172334

New Member
I think, nobody sails absolutly flat, and hikes with really straight legs (mean 180 degrees). Somewere are the optimal(ideal) hiking and stearing technik for every conditions and bodyes. But for begginners much better tend to the straight hiking . This technik may be corrected much easyier. In my opinion.
 

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