Laser rule?

sailingmania

sailingmania

New Member
i have just broken my top mast section! and ripped a 2 week old sail!!! sods law!!! i have notofied the insurance and am about to claim! i am certain i wil get a new mast section, but i terms of a sail? im with "bishop skinner" or now been taken over by "bluefin" the sail is ripped on the mast sleve is this bad enough? or will they pay for it to be repaired? but a new sail would be nice and keep the one i got for club racing.

i was under the impression that any repair on a laser sail is illegal? maybe im wron that what i was told? if this is true do i tell the insurance i need a new sail as i plan to race my boat and enter some big events!

any opinions and comments welcome

Cheers
Jack
 

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sailingmania;

Quoted from the ILCA rules:

26. REPAIRS AND MAINTENANCE
(a) Repairs and preventative maintenance to the sail,
hull, deck, centreboard, rudder, mast, boom or
any fittings and fixings may be carried out without
violation of these Rules provided such repairs
are made in such a way that the essential shape,
characteristics or function of the original are not
affected
 
Thankyou for the quick reply "dwb" that helps!

and for John Gilmour it was about a force 4/5 and was in a radial rig doing parkstone yc poole week (u.k) sailed up to the comitte boat (1.25 miles approx) (upwind) was reaching up and down brilliant waiting for our start, then bore away onto a run thats when it broke! so the rivit must be at the back and it could have been a 1996 top mast section at the very oldest but must have corroded over years and bearing away down wind must have finished it off! i always release the kicker/vang to bear away so it cant be that, had no cunningham on as am rarely overpowered! and outhaul as around average for decent amount of power! (if that helps John)

i suggest checking ur mast section by removing the upper sleve and checking but only "advice" i think the problem is the rivit weakens the mast and theres no really alternative to a rivit, because any decent amount of cunningham tension and the "glue" (if the sleve was glued) would break. as ive seen people pulling huge amounts of cunningham on!
 
How much is the deductible on the insurance?

It doesn't really seem like something that's worth going through insurance for.
 
Sail repairs are legal, but altering the sail by recutting seams, re-sowing or replacing panels including the luff is illegal.

The best option for repairing the sail legally will likely involve the sailmaker pulling the stitching for a short distance so that the luff can by opened up flat, sowing in a patch on the luff where it's torn and then re-sowing the luff back onto the sail in that region. As measurers anything done to the sail stands out really clearly, but we know and recognize this as a legitimate repair job.
 
sailingmania said:
i suggest checking ur mast section by removing the upper sleve and checking but only "advice" i think the problem is the rivit weakens the mast and theres no really alternative to a rivit, because any decent amount of cunningham tension and the "glue" (if the sleve was glued) would break. as ive seen people pulling huge amounts of cunningham on!
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Gluing the sleeve on is also illegal. A rivet in that location is the only legal option.
 
AlanD said:
Sail repairs are legal, but altering the sail by recutting seams, re-sowing or replacing panels including the luff is illegal.

The best option for repairing the sail legally will likely involve the sailmaker pulling the stitching for a short distance so that the luff can by opened up flat, sowing in a patch on the luff where it's torn and then re-sowing the luff back onto the sail in that region. As measurers anything done to the sail stands out really clearly, but we know and recognize this as a legitimate repair job.
Click to expand...

Not trying to be facetious Alan, but is sewing spelled sowing in Oz?
 
:p
To much time spent in the garden lately putting the plants early as our spring has arrived early.

Honestly, I just forgot that there were spelt differently. My mistake, for stitching, it's spelt sewing in Oz.
 
dear "shatty007" the excess i have to pay is £35 not sure weather its per item, but as i am claiming for a new upper mast £125 (roostersailing.com (oficial)) and a sail which is £360 rolled (lasersailing.com)
 
sailingmania said:
dear "shatty007" the excess i have to pay is £35 not sure weather its per item, but as i am claiming for a new upper mast £125 (roostersailing.com (oficial)) and a sail which is £360 rolled (lasersailing.com)
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So basically you are claiming for brand new section when you broke one that was possibly 13 years old? I know it sucks to break it, but it sounds like it was past due. What exactly are you telling your insurance company about how it broke?

Fixing the sleeve is fine and the sail is just as good as new as long as the sail didn't actually split past the sleeve.
 
er173716 said:
So basically you are claiming for brand new section when you broke one that was possibly 13 years old? I know it sucks to break it, but it sounds like it was past due. What exactly are you telling your insurance company about how it broke?

Fixing the sleeve is fine and the sail is just as good as new as long as the sail didn't actually split past the sleeve.
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Most insurance over here in the UK is 'new for old' and covers all racing risks so the cliam in pretty much standard procedure.

I had a boom break at the block rivets and go through the bottom panel. Generally they will replace the sail if the repair goes in to more than 1 panel. (not sure if the luff tube and main part of sail would be classed as seperate panels).

I would speak to them and see what they say but i would certainly not want to sail a regatta/open meeting with a reapired sail.
 
jeffers said:
Most insurance over here in the UK is 'new for old' and covers all racing risks so the cliam in pretty much standard procedure.

I had a boom break at the block rivets and go through the bottom panel. Generally they will replace the sail if the repair goes in to more than 1 panel. (not sure if the luff tube and main part of sail would be classed as seperate panels).

I would speak to them and see what they say but i would certainly not want to sail a regatta/open meeting with a reapired sail.
Click to expand...

Interesting about the insurance.

A repaired sleeve is no big deal to me, I had a sail that was repaired and I would use it in a regatta without hesitation. I don't think I've seen a sail that came from a broken mast that went past the sleeve.
 
er173716 said:
Interesting about the insurance.

A repaired sleeve is no big deal to me, I had a sail that was repaired and I would use it in a regatta without hesitation. I don't think I've seen a sail that came from a broken mast that went past the sleeve.
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A repaired sleeve would be ok, but a repair to one on the main panels I would not want to have. I have seen plenty of sails ripped past the sleeve when a top section lets go.

Edit: Looking at the pic he has posted it looks like sleeve only so as long as a good repair is done it should be fine. I would have no quibbles insisting on a new top section (given that they are rare to find in decent condition second hand).
 
You may have more luck with Bishop skinner but check your policy, it should be clear what is covered new for old & what they will repair or replace. If your with Noblemarine check your policy because it states new for old but this don't cover sails.
 
stuck in the 80s said:
You may have more luck with Bishop skinner but check your policy, it should be clear what is covered new for old & what they will repair or replace. If your with Noblemarine check your policy because it states new for old but this don't cover sails.
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I will check my policy in that case! I have always insured with Noble (a little more expensive than the opposition but never ever had an issue with them).

I have claimed for 2 sails during my Laser sailing career, one ripped when the boom broke one got nicked whilst I was out sailing on a Saturday. They replaced them both.
 
This is off there web site, so to a certain degree I stand corrected

Q. To what extend would my equipment be covered on a standard policy (ie, sails, spars etc)?
A. Some insurers will only pay claims based on a percentage of the new replacement cost of your mast spars or sails, dependant on its age, leaving you to fund the difference. Typically, insurance companies will only pay two thirds of the replacement price on equipment over three years old.

The dinghy policy offered by Noble Marine will pay the full replacement cost of your mast, spars or sails, damaged beyond repair, irrespective of age. All you need to pay is your policy excess.


The word is damaged beyond repair, Assuming your sail is repairable then it will be repaired not replaced.


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