"coloured laser sail"

Discussion in 'Laser Talk' started by fatstratblond, Aug 28, 2006.

  1. fatstratblond

    fatstratblond New Member

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    Hi! did laser sails every come (coloured) I saw a add for a used laser,but it is 4 hour drive from me the add said "laser with coloured sail" and few other things
     
  2. sailor327

    sailor327 New Member

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    yeah they did and i think it was in the early to mid 80's
     
  3. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    Sure there were colored sails.

    Check out this photo of me Ian Lineberger chasing me downwind at a Bruce Cup with my colored sail. He had one of the first 3.8 oz sails for that event and yes he did spend enough time ahead of me in the lighter winds to squeak me out in the points total. In fact District 13 won that Bruce Cup.

    http://www.schrothfiberglass.com/images/80589%20whumping%20Ian%20L.jpg
     
  4. rock steady

    rock steady New Member

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    Thats a very nice sail gouv, great pic too.
     
  5. fatstratblond

    fatstratblond New Member

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    thanks , cool picture
     
  6. Andreas

    Andreas New Member

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    Can anyone tell me if intensity sails have the laser star decal or not? I am afraid they don't, but I haven't seen any in my life. Now I am hesitating about buying one. I know it sounds stupidly, but a laser without a star is not a laser for me... Can we purchase such a decal from anywhere?
     
  7. sailor327

    sailor327 New Member

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    no you cant purchase it if i remember correctly and no the sails dont have them.

    I think they should come out with special edition limited edition laser sails for olympic years and any other special events.
     
  8. Wavedancer

    Wavedancer Upside down? Staff Member

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    We have had this discussion before (http://www.laserforum.org/showthread.php?t=4390).
    The Laser symbol is a registered trademark that is owned by Vanguard. Putting this symbol on a sail yourself is not proper. You may think this is silly, but companies spend lots of money defending their trademarks.
     
  9. fsiewert

    fsiewert New Member

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    That's what happens when the "company" ownes the trademark and not the sailing "assosication".
     
  10. Andreas

    Andreas New Member

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    Yes, in this way, companies are not motivated enough the produce better equipment for lower prices, because their products can't be called "laser" anyway. That's when making profit gets more important than sailing... I am sure that all the authorized Laser producers are making enormous extra-profits at our cost...
     
  11. Laser76489

    Laser76489 Member

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    The sailing association does not own the trademark and therefore will not make the $$ on product sold ...but they also did not invest the money or take the r&d risk or make the product so why would they be entitled to the $ ???

    Yes there is probably money made perhaps even lots of it but those are the rules we play by to be "truly one design"
     
  12. Andreas

    Andreas New Member

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    What You are writing about is a patent. That's what is used for helping the companies in minimizing r&d risk. Patents expire after a certain time, I don't know after how long in the USA but I am almost sure it has already expired in the case of laser sails. Trademark is an other right which is not for minimizing r&d risk but for helping companies in distinguising their products from those of the others. I am not sure if the Laser logo is a trademark, but let's assume it is.
    In this case the best solution could have been granting the association with the rights in connection with the laser logo. And then the laser association would've had the right to decide which producers' sails to award the laser logo and which not. Practically all producers would have to produce the same one design sail in such a situation but there could be at least a price competetion among them. Not like now, where You can buy an almost better intensity sail for not even the half of the price of the "real" laser sail.
     
  13. Andreas

    Andreas New Member

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    Of course, I don't even try to contest that sticking a Laser logo on Your sail is illegal. But I don't think it hurts anyone if You don't want to race with it (then they will find it out anyway) or if You don't sell it to someone else believing it is a Laser sail.
     
  14. Andreas

    Andreas New Member

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    In fact, when we buy a Laser sail, we give something like 500 USD to a monopolist as a gift, assuming that the same sail costs 750 as a laser and 250 as an intensity sail...

    OK I stop provocation now.
     
  15. Merrily

    Merrily Administrator Staff Member

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    No, they've got the rights. I don't know how long a patent lasts. A copyright lasts for 75 years. Lasers have only been around since the 70s. Hey, are there any lawyers here who can tell us when the patents expire on the Laser and the sails? Can they be renewed?
     
  16. Andreas

    Andreas New Member

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    "No, they've got the rights."

    Really? Then how come intensity can produce the same sails? Did they buy the licence? Then they must be really very efficient in production if they sell the sails for less then 250 after having bought the license as well! :))
     
  17. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    Our VP was explaining life to me a few weeks ago and he mentioned something that ought to be in this thread>>>

    Copyrights and patents on products are there to protect the consumer as well as the producer.

    Here in the US, if it has a Laser logo we know it is either aproved by Chip Johns himself or, if found out, somebody has to answer to Chip, his lawyers and even federal prosecutors..

    Chip owns the copyright. The copyright is attached to a specific product line. Nobody else may represent his product as Chips product without Chips express written permission.

    Say whatever you want about Chip and his desire to line his pockets; he absolutely warrants everything he sells.

    The Laser logo means, "Chip Johns and the US government say it will work as represented."

    As a result, the Laser copyright in NA is actually doing exactly as congress intended.
     
  18. sailor327

    sailor327 New Member

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    I am pretty sure they use a different material and they done have anything that says laser on it or has the logo so it is a totally different product and it isnt a laser sail its just a sail that happens to work on a laser.:)
     
  19. fsiewert

    fsiewert New Member

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    So what would be wrong with using an aftermarket sail in a big race....and if you say unfair advantage then ask yourself why the "cheaper" sail is better. Is it planned obsolescense? Or just something else? :confused:
     
  20. sk8ingsailor

    sk8ingsailor Member

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    it might not be class legal! you could be kicked out!
     

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