Capsize

Discussion in 'Capri/Catalina 14 Talk' started by edsandra, Apr 6, 2004.

  1. edsandra

    edsandra New Member

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    I have searched this site and do not see a discussion thread on capsizing. I recently purchased a 1990 Mod 2 Capri 14.2 and am concerned about the boat turtling if I capsize.

    My owner’s manual on page 8 says “The top of the mast is factory sealed and should be checked for leakage. A well sealed masthead will reduce the possibility of turtling.�

    Does the sealed mast really keep the boat from TURTLING? The Vagabond 14 discussion group talks about tying plastic bottles and life jackets to the masthead to prevent turtling. Any discussion on this subject will be greatly appreciated.

    Also, any discussion in general about capsizing would be appreciated.

    Thanks,

    Ed
     
  2. c14_Rudy

    c14_Rudy New Member

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    There's a small section on turtling in the FAQ of this website. I recall quite a bit of discussion on turtling on the previous forum. I don't know if our webmaster can restore any of that for you.
     
  3. Jimbot

    Jimbot New Member

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    Turtling

    Ed,

    I've heard a few ways to prevent your boat from going turtle, here they are:

    1. Check to see that your mast is sealed first of all. Look into the end of it with a flashlight, if it's not sealed, you'll know. If not, go to Home Depot and get a can of "Great Stuff". It's an expanding foam in a can. I bought two cans and a long piece of tubing to fit over the can's nozzle and filled the whole mast with the stuff, just to be sure.

    2. If you buy the 14.2 hand book from this site (I can't tell you how many answers you will find in it) it describes a pocket sewn in to the top 24 inches of the main sail that you can put a piece of styrofoam in.

    3. One guy up hear attached a dock bumper to the front of the mast head. Another guy had a empty milk jug tied to each spreader (not very nice to look at).

    Hope that helps.
     
  4. Art Porter

    Art Porter New Member

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    Turtle

    The foam filled mast may help a little but not in high winds.
    I've had my mast stuck in the mud.
    It's not fun.
    Attached is a picture of the Hobie float that is on the top of my mast.
    With the Hobie float I have had no tendency to turtle.
    There was a write up in the Main Sheet some time back.
     
  5. Art Porter

    Art Porter New Member

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    Picture

    The picture didn't attach.
     

    Attached Files:

  6. Jimbot

    Jimbot New Member

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    Float

    That's a sharp looking float! Is that just a bolt on thing, or did you have to fabricate the bracket?
     
  7. Larry Conrad

    Larry Conrad New Member

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    I have a used hobie float that I am willing to sell. I'll post it on the classified, or let me know if you are interested.
     
  8. regularman

    regularman New Member

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  9. edsandra

    edsandra New Member

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    Thanks for all of the great discussion.

    The FAQ section on Turtling has some good ideas and are definately worth reading. Thanks, Rudy.

    How dificult is it to get back in the boat after a capsize? I read some where that a rope with a loop hung off the transom can be a great help in getting back in the boat.

    I had not considered the possibility that the mast could get stuck in the mud. Art, did you require the assistance of a power boat to get free? That is a really nice looking bracket on your Hobbie Float.

    Kim, where did you buy closed cell foam? That looks to be about 14 to 16 inches high on the luff?

    Again thanks.

    Ed
     
  10. regularman

    regularman New Member

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    edsandra Look around at the other photos in that link by hitting the next button and you will see where I go the foam from. It was a mat that I found at Sam's warehouse. I tested the pieces after I cut them and got 17-18lbs of flotation out of them. It took a while to find something that would work. Some places sell closed cell foam, but some of that breaks down in heat and sun. This stuff looked pretty tough and was till pretty flexible. I got the dimensions from the c14 manual (that the organization sells here) from the floatation sleeve that Catalina sells. I just sewed the foam in permenantly. I haven't had the chance to test it too much yet this year, but I think it will be ok.
     
  11. Chuck Berghoff

    Chuck Berghoff New Member

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    Turtle experience

    The 14.2 does turtle and once done requires significant assistance to right boat (i.e. two power boats). I bought the Catalina floatation cover that extends down the top of the sail 18" or so but think it looks sloppy so mounted a Hobby Mast head float to the mast top. I haven't been "over" since then so don't know how well it works.
     
  12. John Mahaffey

    John Mahaffey New Member

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    capsizing / mast float

    I am that guy that has the gallon jug tied to the mast. It not only does not look all that good but I found out from experience that it does not work. With the help of an inexperienced friend I tipped and flipped. With help from a fisherman and his motor boat we pulled it back to the ramp upside down. I had a problem in that the water was not as deep as the mast is tall. I pulled the pin that holds the forstay to the bow. The jug on my mast floated the mast to the under side of the hull then it was easy to tow , dragging only my furler and jib on the bottom. I want one of those Hobic mast floats. I also lost my outboard motor. I also want another one of those. A bad day sailing is not always better than a good day at work. Thanks for letting me vent.
     
  13. John Mahaffey

    John Mahaffey New Member

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    capsizing / mast float

    I am that guy that has the gallon jug tied to the mast. It not only does not look all that good but I found out from experience that it does not work. With the help of an inexperienced friend I tipped and flipped. With help from a fisherman and his motor boat we pulled it back to the ramp upside down. I had a problem in that the water was not as deep as the mast is tall. I pulled the pin that holds the forstay to the bow. The jug on my mast floated the mast to the under side of the hull then it was easy to tow , dragging only my furler and jib on the bottom. I want one of those Hobic mast floats. I also lost my outboard motor. I also want another one of those. A bad day sailing is not always better than a good day at work. Thanks for letting me vent.
     
  14. Art Porter

    Art Porter New Member

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    Regrets

    I had not followed this thread. Didn't see the questions until now.

    The time I had the mast in the mud I had two skiers stop and swim over to give a hand. We were able to set it up without power. The wind and wave action rotated the boat around the stuck mast untill the boat was down wind from the mast. It than released from the mud and we set it up and I thanked my rescuers and went back to sailing.

    My Hobie float is attached with a wood block shaped to fit the mast and the brackets provided by Hobie.
     
  15. regularman

    regularman New Member

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    So a gallon jug does not provide enough flotation to keep a C14 from turtling? I would have thought that it would be more than enough. I wonder how much flotation is required? You would think that a gallon jug of air 20 feet down in the water would give a lot of lifting force and make the mast come out of the water. What was the problem with righting the boat out in the lake? I have my outboard mounted with clamps but I also have a cable that is pad locked to the outboard motor and then attached to the eyebolt that I have right above my hiking strap on the stern. This was to keep honest folks honest and to prevent sacrificing a motor to the lake Gods should the mount break or the motor come loose in a capsize. This is some good info that we all need to know John Mahaffey , What were all the particulars that you can remember. Were the mainsheet and jibsheet released? Was the wind really high? Do you know what caused the capsize?
     
  16. Chuck Berghoff

    Chuck Berghoff New Member

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    Turtle

    In my case it was relatively light wind but my crew was not on the upwind side of the boat (actually was in the center) when a gust of wind came up and despite releasing the sheets there was too much momentum over and crew was too low in the boat. This is a centerboard model...don't know if that makes it any more sensative to going over.

    ...hence the boat's name now...Over/Easy!

    Chuck
     
  17. msutphen

    msutphen New Member

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    I teach juniors with the 14.2's and they will capsize. A couple of things that I learned from this forum: I got a 3 liter bottle, cut two holes in the bottom through which I ran a line that looped back out through the spout. I then filled the bottle with expanding foam. We attach the loop of line in the main halyard shackle and raise the bottle with the main sail. The boat will float for hours on its side and the kids can take all the time they need to right the boat without fear of turtling. The boat is so wide, the smaller kids have a hard time getting up on the centerboard but if two kids will be patient and pull down on the end of the board it will come up (provided the main is not cleated). The boat is hard to board from the water. I tie a six foot line with a loop on the bitter end to the back of the hiking strap. Once the boat is righted, reach over the transom and retrieve the line and use the loop as a boarding step. I have watched from the dock as kids struggle to right the boat for what seems like an eternity but boy are they gratified when they finally get it up by themselves.
     
  18. regularman

    regularman New Member

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    I have thought of just taking my boat out on a hot day and removing anything that might fall over and capsizing the boat on purpose a couple times just to for practice and to see how difficult it will be should it happen unexpectantly. I also want to know if my floation in the top of the mains'l will be sufficient. I don't think my wife will be game for this though.
     
  19. Art Porter

    Art Porter New Member

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    High wind

    The one thing that makes it hard to check out mast floatation is the effect of high winds on the large area of the bottom of the boat. A float that will keep the boat on its side all day will not keep it from turtling when 20 plus wind is hitting the bottom of the hull. Any amount of floatation will help. The float I have is the one intended for the Hobie 14. I would not want less especially while sailing with young kids. I want to be able to let the boat take care of itself until the I know the kids are OK.
     
  20. jaeger

    jaeger New Member

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    Hobie Mast Float

    Larry Conrad

    Please email me regarding the Hobie mast float.

    Picture?
    Mounting Bracket
    Price?

    art.jaeger@hp.com
    Art
     

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