Sail numbers : euro style and digital

Hello,

I am a Radial Laser sailor from France. In order to save a little money, I usually cut my own sail numbers instead of buying them at my local sail loft. Until now, I have been cutting "european style" numbers, but I am getting tired of it ! So I have the idea of cutting "digital style" numbers that are used in North America : I assume that it is much easier. So I have a few questions about those type of numbers we don't often see over here :

Are they legal all over the world ? In international races ? My wife will be attending several Eurolymp series (Hyeres in France, Medemblik in Holland, Kiel in Germany...) and I don't want her to get in trouble with the measuring there !

Does anybody have a template / measurements of a kind for this type of numbers ? Where can I find them ?

Can I use them for the "national authority" letters as well (FRA in our case) ?

Thanks for your answers.

Jerome
FRA 178996
www.laseratlantique.org

jroch said:

So I have the idea of cutting "digital style" numbers that are used in North America : I assume that it is much easier. So I have a few questions about those type of numbers we don't often see over here :
Are they legal all over the world ?
Does anybody have a template / measurements of a kind for this type of numbers ? Where can I find them ?
Can I use them for the "national authority" letters as well (FRA in our case) ?
Jerome
FRA 178996
www.laseratlantique.org

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Hi Jerome,
I checked the rules http://www.laserinternational.org/rules/ILCARules.pdf
and at rule 4, they talk about numbers. It doesn't have any comment about Euro or digital style, only size and placement. So I think you are safe. It does say that any lettering must be in the same style as the numbers.

I don't know where you can find measurements for the numbers or letters. They are just digital "8s" on a slant that you cut away parts from to create your number, as depicted here: http://www.apsltd.com/Tree/d90000/e88162.asp Scroll 2/3s of the way down.

Hi,

Try using the attached .jpg file. I had to shrink it to put it on here, but you should be able to resize it.

Al Russell 182797

Salut Jerome,
may search where your wife has stored her "ILCA-2005-Handbook" for the Laser. If she sails at such major events that you mention, of course, she has to be member of the ILCA-Region Europe. At this small book look at side 22. From the text I would say, you can use that "digi-style".
You also can ask direct the district-secretary of the Laser Class at France: Jean-Luc Michon ( michonjl{AT}hotmail.com ). He is the "ILCA Chief Measurer" and this means: He is the only one, that is allowed to interprete the ILCA-class-rules.

A bientôt dans Arcachon / Cap Ferrat
"Louis le lâche" - ne pas le XIVième ;0)

you should be fine using either one. I prefer the digital 8s, from ease of cutting, to the way they look, but some like the Euro style better. *shrug*

Folks have had issues with digital "8"s at world champs and other highly-measured events. Something about the edge nearest the leach not being a uniform distance (Do you measure the top/bottom which is closest due to the slant, or the other bottom/top which is farther away?).

For an extra $20USD, I have the retail shop put on the numbers and the country code.

laser158689 said:

(Do you measure the top/bottom which is closest due to the slant, or the other bottom/top which is farther away?).
For an extra $20USD, I have the retail shop put on the numbers and the country code.

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The spacing of the numbers is spelled out clearly in the ILCA rules.

West Coast installed digital numbers for free when I ordered a sail from him. Do you still do that, George?

Merrily said:

The spacing of the numbers is spelled out clearly in the ILCA rules.

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Right, the problem is that the "8"s are slanted so they are not the same distance from the leach top and bottom. The old measurer (Paul Millsom) really had a problem with these numbers... just ask Ian Lineberger!

SFBayLaser said:

Right, the problem is that the "8"s are slanted so they are not the same distance from the leach top and bottom. The old measurer (Paul Millsom) really had a problem with these numbers... just ask Ian Lineberger!

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So what's the remedy? They are class legal, so there has to be a right way to install them, slant or no.

p. 23, 24, 25 of the ILCA handbook deals with this.

You use the left most portion of the # as the start point.

Even if the # slants to the right (for example a digital 8 style # '1'. You use that bottom left corner (furthest left piece of the 1) and measure your 100m in from the leech.


I think the slanted #s look better, but it's all laid out in the handbook, not sure why anyone would get in a fuss as long as the directions are followed.

----
Merrily - I certainly still include sail #s and installation all for free with new sails

Does anybody know why the digital numbers where brought in?

well, they're probably cheaper to make, as it's just one number.

they are easier to stock, as all numbers come from them, and when you are stocking a pile of numbers and colors, it's kind of nice. Won't be ready to number a sail and be missing one 3.

They can also be cut in different ways, slanted, notches, and look a little different for each customer.

Thanks for your answers. I asked the question to Jean-Luc Michon, ILCA chief measurer. Of course, I asked the question in French and he answered in French too. So I will not quote him in French, and I hope not to translate incorrectly what he wrote. But in substance, he said that both systems are legal, provided that they follow closely what is written in the handbook. As I sail in Europe, he recommended that I chose European style, though, because digital style numbers could stand out a little too much on a starting line

Have a good week-end sailing.

Jerome

FRA 178996
www.laseratlantique.org

Hi Jerome,
Where did you get your templates for the European style numbers?

Just purchase a single number if you want the digital or a full set (1-0) of the European style from someone like West Coast and use those as a template.

SFBayLaser said:

Right, the problem is that the "8"s are slanted so they are not the same distance from the leach top and bottom. The old measurer (Paul Millsom) really had a problem with these numbers...

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It seems completely stupid to have a problem with those numbers. If you are using Euro style, and your last number is a 7, it will be a different distance from the top to the leach and from the bottom to the leach!! Boy, a Euro 4 would be a real issue too - do you use the top and bottom of the 4, or the tail of the 4??!! Paul Millsom hopefully found something better to do with his time!

Pls ignore my above post. I just realized the original post about this is 8 years old! For some reason the forum would not let me delete what I posted above.