Watching your self sail your laser ????

mackconsult

Member
Well lets see if I can type this again .... seeing as it all was gone when trying to do a spell check :mad:

Being a mechanical engineer I have an idea that I am thinking about investing some time and $ into. Would other laser sailors be interested in being able to record them selves sailing their laser?

Before spending hours in solid works and modifying my own boat I am hoping to solicit input on this from other laser sailors. MiniDV camcorders are cheap and there are water tight bags available. Battery life on these devices would allow for 2 to 3 hours of recording.

Please let me now if any one else would be interested in a product like this. It would be something that is just added to the boat and hopefully would not add to much weight. Might cost around $30 or $40 to purchase.

Let me know .... before I spend hours in solidworks designing. I would prototype the bracketing and mounting system on my own boat and then could post a quick time clip in my personal comcast webspace for others to view. After hammering out issues the final product would probably be some type of a formed bracket using a standard mounting interface to the camera.

Regards ....:p
 
181255 said:
Being a mechanical engineer I have an idea that I am thinking about investing some time and $ into. Would other laser sailors be interested in being able to record them selves sailing their laser?

I reckon that if you are sailing when it's howling and surfing waves, your self-video would be mighty interesting.

But it seems like the video would be too close up to be able to use it for self coaching. That would be why I would want something like that. We just bought a digital single lens reflex camera so that my husband could get action shots of sailing. That was mostly vanity though. Then I used it to take pictures at a junior regatta. I sent a series of pictures to one of our club's juniors showing him going too wide of the mark and allowing 3 or 4 boats to get ahead of him. The digital stills turned out to be great for coaching too. Now if the video camera would be that cheap and could be used from a safety boat, you might be on to something.

Merrily
 
I would find it very interesting and entertaining but the thing would be a real teaching aid for the jr. club programs and perhaps you should see about marketing this...Just an idea
 
Okay, so I have an 18 foot avon already and will be pursuing over the next year a video camera stabilization system that will be mounted on this avon giving great video shots of sailboats planing and such. Other footage will also be captured by this solution like wind surfers & kite boarders.

The reason I want to do this mount on a laser system is to investigate methodologies of capturing video footage from inside the boat. My thought is that the camera would be mounted about 1.5 to 2 feet behind the laser giving a good field of view of the person in the laser and about a half boat length on both sides of the laser, as well of course the sail and its trim. I will look into several different camera's and give recomendations on which cameras would be the best to use giving the widest field of view.

Regards ....
 
sounds cool Ray, I just don't know where you'd mount it.

First thought was forward, of the cockpit, looking back and up, but you'd need a wide lense for that I guess.

You could mount it on the transom, looking up a bit, but how do you fix it down?

I think what might be coolest is mounted on the bow looking aft. The only really available fairlead is the bow eye. You could clamp something to that, and have it on a gimble so it stays level. You could see most of the sail shape, or the trimming motion at least, and the skippers placement and coordination through tacks.

Wouldn't need as wide angle a lense and it's out of the way. One pound or something on the bow isn't going to make anyone angry if they aren't racing.
 
Thats where my knowledge in engineering will help out is the mounting system.:)

WestCoast said:
sounds cool Ray, I just don't know where you'd mount it.

First thought was forward, of the cockpit, looking back and up, but you'd need a wide lense for that I guess.

You could mount it on the transom, looking up a bit, but how do you fix it down?

I think what might be coolest is mounted on the bow looking aft. The only really available fairlead is the bow eye. You could clamp something to that, and have it on a gimble so it stays level. You could see most of the sail shape, or the trimming motion at least, and the skippers placement and coordination through tacks.

Wouldn't need as wide angle a lense and it's out of the way. One pound or something on the bow isn't going to make anyone angry if they aren't racing.
 
In the problem-may-already-be-solved-but-there-probably-is-a-better-mousetrap department, you might want to contact Steve Cockerill at Rooster Sailing to see how he went about mounting cameras on his Laser. He has a new series of DVD's he is selling (the "Boat Whisperer" series) and the description of these DVD's I saw in the latest LaserWorld shows a few shots taken from these Laser mounted cameras. I guess he had cameras mounted on the transom looking forward and at the top of the mast looking down. It looks interesting...

Tracy
 
Interesting that this is a topic, as I was thinking about this the other day. I have been studying a book and a DVD (2000 Laser coach disc) and thought that when I DO purchase my first Laser, I will want to critique my performance. The front cover of the book I have read (Laser racing tecniques) indeed has a top-mast-mounted camera shot (pointing down) gracing the cover. I have not thought too much about it, but I assumed one can find dirt-cheap mini cams out there.

One comment...the Lasercoach 2000 DVD is informative....but the actual filming is crappy, save for maybe one reaching clip.

A steadycam mount would be ideal for chase boat sequences..AND A LONG ZOOM......for pete's sake, when Robert Sheidt went 4 boat-lengths away in the video...he almost dissapeared!!

I think if you can come up with a lens that covers a decent field of view...then it would be valuable...

Down here in Miami we have 'spy shops' where I can probably find miniature video cameras...perfect for mounting, say, 4 so you can edit the thing and see the action from a few different vantage points

Just rambling...

Ray
Miami Beach
 
I mounted a regular 8mm video camera on the bow of my C-scow one time. Winds were about 8 to 10 so spray getting the camera wet wasn't a problem. It was on the bow facing aft, sitting on a small tripod which was bungeed to the bow eye. It worked great, and because the camera and the boat bounce together the picture wasn't jittery. Because of that I don't think you'd need a steady-cam mount if the camera faced the interior of the boat. What was really cool was when the boat heeled way over - on the screen the boat stayed flat and the horizon turned to about 45 degrees because the camera leaned with the boat! Anyway, I think it would be a useful device especially for figuring out how clumsy I look doing a roll tack. Such a camera might help me do better at this.

How feasible would it be to transmit the video image to a nearby coach, so the coach could watch live and provide feedback?
 
Well, the steady-cam mount I was referring to would be for a chase boat----but I get your comments. I can imagine that heeling shot WOULD be a neat effect.

I was researching a bit after I saw this thread, and I went to an R.C. airplane forum (similar to this one). A lot of folks strap cameras to their planes.....I saw a few clips and they were alright. The cameras they use (it seems) transmit back to a base unit, but you need a ham radio operators license for the thing!!.. They all talked about spy cams, e.t.c. being the most logical, as they are small.

I would not want to transmit to anyone. I'm going to the local spy shop to see what they have. I would really like to set up 3 or 4 of them and edit it all down.
 
Back to your question - I think there would be a market for it, for all sailors - those who wanted to see what they were doing right and wrong and could and could not afford a coach and for those who wanted footage for their own "home movies" and for posterity after they are gone (in keeping with the "Beat the Nursing Home.... bumper sticker).
 
Best way to do it is to use miniDV like GL1 or GL2 or other high end equipement that is stabilized on a boat. I am actually working on a camera stabilization system that could be mounted on a RIB (Like mine). The purpose would be to be able to take video footage of dinghies planing down in the gorge, or even wind surfers and kite boarders. The problem with filming in these conditions is that the power boat has to keep up with these items of interest, which is usually in breezy chopy conditions. The system I am designing would "float" over the water with the miniDV camcorder attatched to it giving a steady plaform for video recording in any conditions or speeds.

Keep an eye on my website .... nothing there yet on this effort but soon there will be. http://www.mackconsult.com/

Regards ....

Sunray said:
Well, the steady-cam mount I was referring to would be for a chase boat----but I get your comments. I can imagine that heeling shot WOULD be a neat effect.

I was researching a bit after I saw this thread, and I went to an R.C. airplane forum (similar to this one). A lot of folks strap cameras to their planes.....I saw a few clips and they were alright. The cameras they use (it seems) transmit back to a base unit, but you need a ham radio operators license for the thing!!.. They all talked about spy cams, e.t.c. being the most logical, as they are small.

I would not want to transmit to anyone. I'm going to the local spy shop to see what they have. I would really like to set up 3 or 4 of them and edit it all down.
 
My idea is the transom, that we you can see everything you would see from the bow, but also everything in front of you. Like the start, marks, crossings, the finish .....

jim anderson said:
I mounted a regular 8mm video camera on the bow of my C-scow one time. Winds were about 8 to 10 so spray getting the camera wet wasn't a problem. It was on the bow facing aft, sitting on a small tripod which was bungeed to the bow eye. It worked great, and because the camera and the boat bounce together the picture wasn't jittery. Because of that I don't think you'd need a steady-cam mount if the camera faced the interior of the boat. What was really cool was when the boat heeled way over - on the screen the boat stayed flat and the horizon turned to about 45 degrees because the camera leaned with the boat! Anyway, I think it would be a useful device especially for figuring out how clumsy I look doing a roll tack. Such a camera might help me do better at this.

How feasible would it be to transmit the video image to a nearby coach, so the coach could watch live and provide feedback?
 
Recorded video would be better, coaches could rewind very easily, pause, and make voice over comments ...

jim anderson said:
I mounted a regular 8mm video camera on the bow of my C-scow one time. Winds were about 8 to 10 so spray getting the camera wet wasn't a problem. It was on the bow facing aft, sitting on a small tripod which was bungeed to the bow eye. It worked great, and because the camera and the boat bounce together the picture wasn't jittery. Because of that I don't think you'd need a steady-cam mount if the camera faced the interior of the boat. What was really cool was when the boat heeled way over - on the screen the boat stayed flat and the horizon turned to about 45 degrees because the camera leaned with the boat! Anyway, I think it would be a useful device especially for figuring out how clumsy I look doing a roll tack. Such a camera might help me do better at this.

How feasible would it be to transmit the video image to a nearby coach, so the coach could watch live and provide feedback?
 
I quess so .... but we as racers spend to much time with our heads in our boats and not enough time looking around which is what we should be doing ....

WestCoast said:
top of the mast looking down would be pretty hot.
 
Cameras are cheap and expandable ... its what you do with the content that becomes difficult ...

Besides imagine what cool production you could have with content from chase boat and the stern with the correct editing.

WestCoast said:
we're going to need more cameras.........:eek:
 
Thanks for all the posts folks. This sounds like an interesting concept, that people might be interested in. I will work on some solutions and start capturing some video, then create some quicktime clips and post them to my webspace for people to view. I will ping this group as things are developed ....

Regards ...
 
I have taken footage of myself during the off season. I have a waterproof case for my still camera. I set in on video and simply hooked it under by centreboard bungee. It work suprisingly well upwind. Then down wind I would just cleat the main and grab it with my hand - film whatever I wanted. I then edited out all the jerky bits using Windows XP movie maker.
 
the question rock......was it helpful to you?

I bet it was cool footage, but did you learn or see anything in your sailing on the video that led to you improving your sailing?
 
It was mostly for fun, but it did show a few useful things. For example I could see I was crossing the boat a tad early during tacks, and that my boat wasn't exactly flat even when I thought it was.
 
Hi All....
Taking a page from some ole David Letterman shows... How about a helmet mounted cam to see excately what the sailor is looking at and focused on. Perhaps develop constructive critique from it? Me thinks mounted sidemounted so as not to interfer with the boom crossing and a cam bashing resulting from it.
Fishingmickey
150087/181157
 
Rock Steady is right,(was fortunate enough to see his edited clip)

Simple waterproof case for your camera attached under the c.board shockcord gives a good view of how you tack etc - and the horizon is clearly visible, so you can see if you are as 'flat' as you think you are. Experimenting with bow mounted positioning may improve the view - but for sail trim evaluation, a head-cam approach (like that used in the 18ft skiffs) might be better.

To evaluate kinetics you probably need a support boat to see the 'big picture' or alternatively you could sail with a training partner watching you with a head-cam unit.

Best deathroll would be good footage
 
I found a waterproof case at Gander Mountain (a sporting goods chain) which is about the shape and size of a lunchbox, and is clear. I think I might try my video camera in it. Of course it will be a far cry from a transom-mounted steady-cam or anything like that, but if reading these postings inspires anyone to shoot video on the water, this might be a cheap way to do it.
 

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