Shaping an Intensity sail

Merrily

Administrator
Thread starter #1
I bought an Intensity Radial sail and am having trouble with it. In light to medium air, I can't get rid of the lump of cloth behind the luff that runs vertically on the entire height of the sail. I think this is a factor of the extra cloth weight and extra resin in the sail, making it stiffer, and I've seen it on a full sized Intensity sail, as well. Normally, one could adjust the outhaul to pull this "lump" out, but it doesn't work with this sail. The mast sleeve is also wider than on my legal sail and I don't know if this is a factor in the sloppiness of the sail. Can anyone who has an Intensity sail guide me? Is there a way to flatten this sail?
 
#2
I bought an Intensity Radial sail and am having trouble with it. In light to medium air, I can't get rid of the lump of cloth behind the luff that runs vertically on the entire height of the sail. I think this is a factor of the extra cloth weight and extra resin in the sail, making it stiffer, and I've seen it on a full sized Intensity sail, as well. Normally, one could adjust the outhaul to pull this "lump" out, but it doesn't work with this sail. The mast sleeve is also wider than on my legal sail and I don't know if this is a factor in the sloppiness of the sail. Can anyone who has an Intensity sail guide me? Is there a way to flatten this sail?
I actually have the same problem with my new Laser standard sail (manufacturer supplied) in light airs - so it may not be an Intensity only thing.


Ian
 

Merrily

Administrator
Thread starter #3
I actually have the same problem with my new Laser standard sail (manufacturer supplied) in light airs - so it may not be an Intensity only thing.


Ian
It's not the same wrinkle as described in the Ah the Wrinkle thread. It's totally vertical. It doesn't go from where the mast pieces join. It goes from the head of the sail right behind the mast sleeve, runs the entire length of the mast, to the tack.

Yes, I've also had this same vertical wrinkle on a legal sail, but you can get rid of it by playing with the sail controls. I can't get the Intensity wrinkle to go away.
 
#4
It's not the same wrinkle as described in the Ah the Wrinkle thread. It's totally vertical.
I have both the "Ah wrinkle" wrinkle and loads of material close to the mast. The "Ah wrinkle" is when there is some wind and I double block the main sheet. The thing you are describing here I have in light winds. I'm sure its my and getting used to the sail adjustments.


Ian
 
#5
It's not the same wrinkle as described in the Ah the Wrinkle thread. It's totally vertical. It doesn't go from where the mast pieces join. It goes from the head of the sail right behind the mast sleeve, runs the entire length of the mast, to the tack.

Yes, I've also had this same vertical wrinkle on a legal sail, but you can get rid of it by playing with the sail controls. I can't get the Intensity wrinkle to go away.
Maybe more vang and less cunningham would work? Is there any chance that your top section is bent? That might be causing it too.
 

Merrily

Administrator
Thread starter #6
Maybe more vang and less cunningham would work? Is there any chance that your top section is bent? That might be causing it too.
My top section is not bent. It's light air, so I'm using little to no cunningham. I've tried varying the vang, too.
 
#7
Is there any chance that your top section is bent? That might be causing it too.
Mine - unlikely. New this year and not been out in any really heavy winds yet - miserable winds this summer. Also, whilst still learning the techniques for a Laser I'm being cautious with the vang (a high purchase one) as I don't want to overdo it and damage the mast (yet - read that a lot of vang then bear away risks bending the top section so I'm still at the "careful" stage).

Ian
 

Rob B

Active Member
#8
Our experience, (we have about 12 guys using these sails) has been that the sail does not like cunningham in any breeze. Also, it does not like the outhaul to be "cranked" on either. The best thing to do for cunningham adjustment is "snug it up" from time to time while going upwind, but never cleat it. Just pull the wrinkles out and keep going. Vang is necessary for leech tension as with the legal sail. Also, as withthe legal sail, the wrinkles are ugly, but do not affect speed or pointing.
 

Merrily

Administrator
Thread starter #9
Our experience, (we have about 12 guys using these sails) has been that the sail does not like cunningham in any breeze. Also, it does not like the outhaul to be "cranked" on either. The best thing to do for cunningham adjustment is "snug it up" from time to time while going upwind, but never cleat it. Just pull the wrinkles out and keep going. Vang is necessary for leech tension as with the legal sail. Also, as withthe legal sail, the wrinkles are ugly, but do not affect speed or pointing.
I don't think you are understanding me. This is not a speed wrinkle. It is a totally vertical wrinkle, say a 4 to 5 inch lump of cloth, behind the mast. It is certainly affecting my speed. Nothing I do EVER makes the wrinkle go away in light air. It's light air and I'm not cranking anything on.
 
#10
I know just what you mean seen it on my radial too, almost like a bulge like theres another mast behind the sail just after the first mast (a real fold from the top of the mast to the cunningham eye- note mines a laser/PSE sail not Intensity)...I can't quite remember what id did but it maybe cunningham nearly all off just a little more outhaul and perhaps just a squeek more vang (my off position on my vang is pretty tight anyway now- 30cms or so between block to block when mainsheet is released)
 
#11
It's light air and I'm not cranking anything on.
A Laser sail is a flat, one dimensional sail with a curved luff. When you put it on a straight mast, there will be a crease from the top of the mast down the luff. If you put some vang on to bend the mast, the crease should go away.

Shouldn't you be using your class legal sail anyway if it is only light air?

Also, if you and Bradley haven't scared away the sailmaker with your recent censorship of his posts, and since you obviously know who he is, why don't you just ask him?
 

Rob B

Active Member
#12
:eek:

Also, if you and Bradley haven't scared away the sailmaker with your recent censorship of his posts, and since you obviously know who he is, why don't you just ask him?[/QUOTE]
 

Rob B

Active Member
#13
I don't think you are understanding me. This is not a speed wrinkle. It is a totally vertical wrinkle, say a 4 to 5 inch lump of cloth, behind the mast. It is certainly affecting my speed. Nothing I do EVER makes the wrinkle go away in light air. It's light air and I'm not cranking anything on.
It won't go away. It's affecting your speed because you're thinking about it too much and not concentrating on where the pointy end of the boat is going. :p We have top guys sailing these sails against top guys with class sails. There is no speed difference. Well, some of the class sail guys say the Intensity points a little better.
 
#14
Sailchris is pretty spot on, IMHO. What Merrily is describing is too much luff curve put into the sail as compared to the amount her mast is bending.

It could be either Merrily has found a very stiff mast or perhaps a qc issue in the building of the sail (such as a luff tube made too wide, or a bad job of sticking the luff tube onto the luff curve on the actual sail)

If it were me, I would let someone else put the sail up on their mast, to eliminate the mast. If the problem is still there, it's time to call the sailmaker - a couple of photos, with the sail two blocked and vang snug will help him
 

Merrily

Administrator
Thread starter #16
Well, I don't appreciate being patronized by Rob B.

Also, because one person has a problem with an Intensity sail, it's the end?

Thanks, Greg, for your considered reply. I'll look into it.
 
R

Ross B

Guest
#17
Best solution is burn it and buy a real sail....sounds like the beginning of the end of this knock off wanna be.....
So those rumors that you guys were gonna be making your own sails are false? darn, I was really looking forward to buying one...
 

Merrily

Administrator
Thread starter #19
/Begin disclaimer for the Administrator/
Please note that the above post is intended as satire and/or humor.
/End disclaimer for the Administrator/
TROLLing for humor? It's not funny when you try too hard.

I've put out a serious post as a member of this forum, and it's turning into twaddle.
 
#20
One thought:
Lay your class OK sail on the ground, stretch a bit of line between the head and e.g. Cunningham hole and measure the max distance between the line and the luff (maybe the position of the max as well though probably not so important. Then repeat with the Intensity sail and see if there is any difference.

Alternatively, lay them on top of each other and see if/where they are of different size.

Somebody said that Laser sails are built flat and the fullness is put in though a curved luff. Thus, the comparison should indicate if there is a significant difference.

Maybe repeat with other peoples' class and Intensity sails.

Ian


EDIT: And, if you do the above, do let us know the results. It is probably a matter of degree and it would be interesting to have a feel for the differences and variability.
 
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