Second Sail Tomorrow - Could Use Some Advice!

Guybrush3pwood

Active Member
My second ever sail happens tomorrow. I took the day off work. As you can see, there's a bit of an obstacle. Namely, a rock wall that spans the width of the lake right where I get in via the public boat launch. There is a narrow gap, about the width of a car and a half that I have to get through with winds coming in from the north/north west direction. I'm guessing I might be able to close haul it on a port tack, but failing that I guess I'm whipping out the paddle. Anyway, how would you handle this? Curious to get everyone's thoughts on this.

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Why do you need to cross the barrier if the wind is from the north? The pic I found of the causeway shows it’s 2-3 feet high. It’ll have minimal impact on the wind. Just don’t go too far downwind until you are confident you can get back upwind.

Once you are a better sailor you can try getting thru the gap.
 
Oh, sorry, maybe I didn't explain it very well.

So I'm not worried about the effect the wall will have on the wind, I'm worried about being at enough of an angle to be close hauled rather than being in irons given the direction of the wind and the location of the gap.

If I don't go through the gap, I'm going to be stuck in this little section of the lake where I'll be relegated to just doing donuts. Where's the fun in that?

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Paddle through at first if you're uncomfortable with the gap... later, when you're more proficient and you exercise good timing, you can tack through the gap, no problem. Might even be able to build boat speed, pinch or luff a bit while gliding through the gap, then fall off again and resume your original course. :D

Be careful even when you're sailing downwind and tackling the gap: watch your lower boom end so ya don't smash it against the rocks and damage it. You can momentarily 'raise' that boom end by heeling a bit in the opposite direction, using your body weight (live ballast) to achieve the desired angle. :rolleyes:

Any question about the depth of that gap? Any rocks lurking below the surface? Take a good look and make sure your boat's draft doesn't exceed the depth of the gap, otherwise you'll need to raise your daggerboard a bit as well. :(

Take it from a veteran who has crossed semi-submerged Zuniga Jetty in San Diego a thousand times... gaps can be tricky, especially when ya hafta TIME your crossing or passage. This gap doesn't look too bad, nowhere NEAR as dicey as the jetty during ebb tide with a strong swell running, lol. :cool:

Edit: Further advice, gratis... don't forget the beer on ice!!! ;)
 
Yup, tacking is at the top of my list this trip.

While we're on the subject of paddling, what's the proper way to paddle in a sunfish? Sails down? Daggerboard in or out? Rudder down in the water or up? If down, how do I steer using the daggerboard if both my hands are busy paddling?

It'll be interesting to see how I do at raising and lowering the sails while under way. I'm up for the challenge!
 
If I don't go through the gap, I'm going to be stuck in this little section of the lake where I'll be relegated to just doing donuts. Where's the fun in that?

Looks like about a mile in that part of the lake. With the wind from the N/NW you’ll have plenty of room sailing and practicing your skills. Since this is your second sailing adventure, stay away from the jetty/dam rocks. For sure you’ll need to take on the gap eventually, but save it for another day.
 
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Looks like about a mile in that part of the lake. With the wind from the N/NW you’ll have plenty of room sailing and practicing your skills. Since this is your second sailing adventure, stay away from the jetty/dam rocks. For sure you’ll need to take on the gap eventually, but save it for another day.
Agree. A mile long body of water is a lot of room in a Sunfish. I can assure you on your second sail it’s going to take you a minimum of 30 minutes to go a mile upwind in a good breeze. Honestly I’d encourage you to go downwind just a bit as you have to be sure you can get back upwind. Plus reaching back and forth will be more fun and it doesn’t matter what part of the lake you will be on to reach.

Paddling is a pain as the sail, which should be down if there is any wind, will be in the way. The rudder should be up too. Read or watch an article or video on how to paddle a canoe for advice. I suggest you kneel on the bow and paddle from there.
I don’t know about the board.
 
I just looked at a map of your area. If you are concerned about the causeway, have you considered going to Skaneatles or Cazenovia Lake? They both are nice bodies Of water without a causeway cutting them in two.
 
It'll be interesting to see how I do at raising and lowering the sails while under way. I'm up for the challenge!
Sometimes, while raising the sail, the gooseneck drags/locks on the mast. Repositioning it on the boom so it points (tilts) upwards a bit will reduce or eliminate that difficulty.
 
Willow Bank Yacht Club in Cazenovia, NY will host the annual Jack Rutz Memorial One-Day Sunfish Regatta on beautiful Cazenovia Lake on Saturday, July 24, 2021.

-Skippers Meeting: 10:00 AM
-First race 10:30 AM
-5 short races, low point scoring, usually off the lake by 1:30 - 2:00 PM
-$20 entrance includes post racing lunch
-Trophies for top 3 finishers
-Free camping if you want to arrive Friday evening

Contact person: Alan Glos, Sunfish Fleet Captain and Regatta Chair. (315) 655-8396 or (315) 247-1811 (Cell) [email protected]
 
I just looked at a map of your area. If you are concerned about the causeway, have you considered going to Skaneatles or Cazenovia Lake? They both are nice bodies Of water without a causeway cutting them in two.

Caz is a bit far but not impossible, Skaneateles I think has a single public boat launch that's perpetually busy, but it's not a bad idea. Maybe it wouldn't be so bad on a Friday afternoon.

Ok, Skaneateles it is! We'll save Otisco for another day.
 
I look forward to seeing it. I’m a beginner too. Have been out more than twice, but never for very long and so far just practicing tacking. We always seem to have more wind than I’m comfortable with. Hoping for a calmer day tomorrow or Sunday. We’ll see if the forecast holds
 
I'll admit I don't have to paddle far, but I use a short-handled one which stows easy in the cubby. I leave the board and rudder down and steer with the rudder. Furl the sail with a couple of ties so it doesn't flop in the water and make sure it doesn't interfere with the tiller. I sit with my feet in the cockpit, usually paddle with my right hand/arm and steer with my left. Never could grasp the canoe/paddle idea. My way the "fish is always under control.
 
We leave the daggerboard and rudder down so we can steer, and let the sail luff for short jaunts like that. Small paddle. Once through the gap all you do is fall off a bit and sheet in, go sailing.

 
I'll admit I don't have to paddle far, but I use a short-handled one which stows easy in the cubby. I leave the board and rudder down and steer with the rudder. Furl the sail with a couple of ties so it doesn't flop in the water and make sure it doesn't interfere with the tiller. I sit with my feet in the cockpit, usually paddle with my right hand/arm and steer with my left. Never could grasp the canoe/paddle idea. My way the "fish is always under control.
Windy day yesterday, and lost my paddle overboard before getting in! :(

So I borrowed a kayak paddle, rested the spars on the tiller, and paddled into a strong, gusty, direct-headwind--both boards down.

Slow going--but controlled--it went well. :) A longer paddle would have been an improvement. :cool:
 
We leave the daggerboard and rudder down so we can steer, and let the sail luff for short jaunts like that. Small paddle. Once through the gap all you do is fall off a bit and sheet in, go sailing.

I agree with signal charlie. The one note I would add is that I lean with my back (butt?) against the tiller to keep the rudder aligned while I paddle. For shorter jaunts, I use a hand paddle with one hand and control the tiller with the other. The only time I paddle with the sail down is if I am heading directly into a headwind that is strong enough to prevent forward motion even with a luffing sail.
 
Folks, while short on sailing's technicalities, this is maybe the "BEST-OF" Sunfish videos going! :)

There is far less annoying "face-time", the editings are short, funny, and appropriate. The music, ending with peaceful acoustic guitar chords we can only imagine--while quietly scudding along--is superb!

As the venture begins, however, the music transports us to an era when Western Civilization is preserved by a "Winged-Hussars" calvary charge by the Polish king, Jan Sobieski, at the Gates of Vienna.

The day is saved!

My only criticism is the narrator's Valley-Girl inflections of the English language!

There really is a "T" in the word, "certain". ;)
 
Hilarious editing, the forehead-slapping number was appropriate, lol. Some tyro mistakes, and I see swimming in your near future, but the lake looks nice! Don't ditch the hat, just swap it for a ballcap... you're gonna want that bill over your eyes to prevent a glare headache, believe me. Every pro skipper I ever met (sailing, sportfishing, etc.) wore a hat or cap of some sort, and you'll want to do the same. Later, when you're more proficient, you can experiment with the wide-brimmed hat again... don't forget sunscreen on the neck with the ballcap, otherwise you'll be a redneck for sure! ;)

Very funny video, keep up the good work!!! AIR may have some competition in the future, lol. I probably would've chosen different soundtracks, but I'm an old rogue dinosaur raised on The Ventures, Johnny Cash, The Mighty Zep, Pink Floyd, Dead Kennedys, Sex Pistols, et al. I DID like the acoustic guitar segment, looked like ya had a handle on the sailing at that point. Hopefully your tacking speed improves, and I'm sure it will, but that one tack took FOREVER, lol... still, you're doing a fine job for your second voyage. Have you read any books or web material on basic sailing? Those with diagrams on maneuvering? Diagrams are good... :rolleyes:
 
Oh, yeah, about those wind shifts: you'll wanna be ready for those at any time, or your chances of swimming will increase. You'll learn soon enough about headers & lifts, some wind shifts are actually favorable and can help you point higher. Why NOT take advantage of them? Most wind shifts only span a few degrees on the compass, but some are more drastic, especially when surrounding landforms come into play... tall structures on shore as well, though they usually only create a "wind shadow" which will rob your sail of wind. Tall-rigged sailboats passing to windward have the same effect, you'll learn to lean inboard when ya hit those rolling wind blocks, lol. :confused:

Weirdest wind shift I ever experienced was a 180-degree shift on the Salton Sea, but that was more prolonged... the 20+ knot wind quickly died down and shifted from NNE to SSW over a period of 15 to 20 minutes, then built back up to around 10 knots, making the formerly-exciting voyage a mere pleasure cruise, lol. Meh, made it easier to drink beer without spillage... and odd things happen in the desert, where weather can be quite dynamic. The Salton occasionally sees what locals call "wind events"---where winds gust to 100 m.p.h. as measured by meteorologists. Believe me, you do NOT wanna be sailing your Sunfish when those wind events occur, unless you like heller drama, lol. :eek:

Edit: Let me give you a little tip... whenever you're sailing close-hauled on a lake (or any other body of water with land on the horizon), choose a temporary mark on shore to guide you. A building, a tall tree, a smokestack or tower, something that stands out and is readily noted at a glance. Use that temporary mark to hold your course, and also to determine if the wind has shifted. Sometimes a novice may not realize that the wind has shifted in his or her favor, but that realization will come in due time with enough experience. Once you've tacked, choose another mark to guide you on the next leg of your voyage. Makes things easier in the long run, and of course you can also use such marks on other points of sail. Cheers!!!!! :cool:
 
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Folks, while short on sailing's technicalities, this is maybe the "BEST-OF" Sunfish videos going! :)

There is far less annoying "face-time", the editings are short, funny, and appropriate. The music, ending with peaceful acoustic guitar chords we can only imagine--while quietly scudding along--is superb!

As the venture begins, however, the music transports us to an era when Western Civilization is preserved by a "Winged-Hussars" calvary charge by the Polish king, Jan Sobieski, at the Gates of Vienna.

The day is saved!

My only criticism is the narrator's Valley-Girl inflections of the English language!

There really is a "T" in the word, "certain". ;)

Wow! Thanks for the kind words! I'll work on my annunciation, although, I don't really have any plans to do any further videos so maybe it won't be an issue. ;)

Hilarious editing, the forehead-slapping number was appropriate, lol. Some tyro mistakes, and I see swimming in your near future, but the lake looks nice! Don't ditch the hat, just swap it for a ballcap... you're gonna want that bill over your eyes to prevent a glare headache, believe me. Every pro skipper I ever met (sailing, sportfishing, etc.) wore a hat or cap of some sort, and you'll want to do the same. Later, when you're more proficient, you can experiment with the wide-brimmed hat again... don't forget sunscreen on the neck with the ballcap, otherwise you'll be a redneck for sure! ;)

Very funny video, keep up the good work!!! AIR may have some competition in the future, lol. I probably would've chosen different soundtracks, but I'm an old rogue dinosaur raised on The Ventures, Johnny Cash, The Mighty Zep, Pink Floyd, Dead Kennedys, Sex Pistols, et al. I DID like the acoustic guitar segment, looked like ya had a handle on the sailing at that point. Hopefully your tacking speed improves, and I'm sure it will, but that one tack took FOREVER, lol... still, you're doing a fine job for your second voyage. Have you read any books or web material on basic sailing? Those with diagrams on maneuvering? Diagrams are good... :rolleyes:

Oh trust me, it's not my first choice of music either, but given youtube's copyright claim rules I'm limited to what I can use.

I have read Sailing for Dummies (well, most of it. It's not meant to be ready in a linear fashion like most books), but I think I'm ready for another one.

Oh, yeah, about those wind shifts: you'll wanna be ready for those at any time, or your chances of swimming will increase. You'll learn soon enough about headers & lifts, some wind shifts are actually favorable and can help you point higher. Why NOT take advantage of them? Most wind shifts only span a few degrees on the compass, but some are more drastic, especially when surrounding landforms come into play... tall structures on shore as well, though they usually only create a "wind shadow" which will rob your sail of wind. Tall-rigged sailboats passing to windward have the same effect, you'll learn to lean inboard when ya hit those rolling wind blocks, lol. :confused:

Weirdest wind shift I ever experienced was a 180-degree shift on the Salton Sea, but that was more prolonged... the 20+ knot wind quickly died down and shifted from NNE to SSW over a period of 15 to 20 minutes, then built back up to around 10 knots, making the formerly-exciting voyage a mere pleasure cruise, lol. Meh, made it easier to drink beer without spillage... and odd things happen in the desert, where weather can be quite dynamic. The Salton occasionally sees what locals call "wind events"---where winds gust to 100 m.p.h. as measured by meteorologists. Believe me, you do NOT wanna be sailing your Sunfish when those wind events occur, lol. :eek:

Edit: Let me give you a little tip... whenever you're sailing close-hauled on a lake (or any other body of water with land on the horizon), choose a temporary mark on shore to guide you. A building, a tall tree, a smokestack or tower, something that stands out and is readily noted at a glance. Use that temporary mark to hold your course, and also to determine if the wind has shifted. Sometimes a novice may not realize that the wind has shifted in his or her favor, but that realization will come in due time with enough experience. Once you've tacked, choose another mark to guide you on the next leg of your voyage. Makes things easier in the long run, and of course you can also use such marks on other points of sail. Cheers!!! :cool:

That's a great idea! I will definitely do that. Yeah, that gust of wind really took me off guard.
 
ROYCE'S SAILING ILLUSTRATED has always been the small craft sailor's bible, but it contains heaps of information which is NOT relevant for someone just starting out... it'll actually confuse a novice sailor with TOO MUCH information. :confused:

See if you can find and order a copy of the ARC (American Red Cross) book BASIC SAILING, that little book has been around for over half a century and it has some nice diagrams which are easy to read and understand. The USCG used to distribute that book back in the day, dunno if they still do, but you can probably find a copy online for a few bucks... maybe someone even posted the contents, that's on you to discover. ;)

Such a book would really help you grasp the essentials when it comes to safely maneuvering... we used it in the '70s during our sail training courses at SDNSC, it was great for classroom instruction. I highly recommend this book to you and all other novice sailors just getting started... it makes for easy reading and the diagrams are excellent! I'm no shill for the publisher either, lol, but marine safety is my TOP PRIORITY whenever I'm on the water. :cool:
 
ROYCE'S SAILING ILLUSTRATED has always been the small craft sailor's bible, but it contains heaps of information which is NOT relevant for someone just starting out... it'll actually confuse a novice sailor with TOO MUCH information. :confused:

See if you can find and order a copy of the ARC (American Red Cross) book BASIC SAILING, that little book has been around for over half a century and it has some nice diagrams which are easy to read and understand. The USCG used to distribute that book back in the day, dunno if they still do, but you can probably find a copy online for a few bucks... maybe someone even posted the contents, that's on you to discover. ;)

Such a book would really help you grasp the essentials when it comes to safely maneuvering... we used it in the '70s during our sail training courses at SDNSC, it was great for classroom instruction. I highly recommend this book to you and all other novice sailors just getting started... it makes for easy reading and the diagrams are excellent! I'm no shill for the publisher either, lol, but marine safety is my TOP PRIORITY whenever I'm on the water. :cool:

Very cool! I'll check that out. Does it look like this? I'll see if I can track down a copy.

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That's the very one... first published in the mid-'60s, lol, but a great book for novice sailors, you'll learn fast after reading it and checking the diagrams! :cool:

Depending upon your location, you might find ROYCE'S SAILING ILLUSTRATED on a library shelf... the Coronado Library used to have a copy. :)
 
I very much enjoyed this video. Beautiful day, beautiful boat and beautiful setting. One thing to be careful of is when your daggerboard is up and extends above the lower boom, you need to keep a good eye on it. If the wind shifts, it can run the boom/sail into the top of the daggerboard, stop the sail and over you go. Had that happen a couple of times. I really liked watching this and may have to figure out how to post videos. I have some really nice footage of sailing my Oldfish in Wisconsin last summer.
 
Looks good. Get a piece of cassette tape and tie it to a clip on the lower boom in front of the pulley. Simple wind indicator. Get a shock cord from one side of the boat to the other behind the center board. It will help hold the board in the trunk if you tip over.
 
Here's the video. Sorry it took so long. Hope you guys enjoy.

Great video Guybrush3pwood. A little bit creepy that Will Smith would be spying on you like that (You'd think he has better things to do.) It looks like you have a ratchet block mounted to the lip of the cubby for the mainsheet. Is that right? I agree with you, the Sunfish can be a real blast. What camera equipment do you use and how is it mounted? Would love to see more videos.
 
Looks good. Get a piece of cassette tape and tie it to a clip on the lower boom in front of the pulley. Simple wind indicator. Get a shock cord from one side of the boat to the other behind the center board. It will help hold the board in the trunk if you tip over.
An alternative is to tape a stiff zip tie to the end of the upper boom and attach the cassette tape there. I find that there is a lot of turbulence close to the boat giving misleading wind indications (though it is easier to look at a wind indicator on the lower boom than craning your neck back to see a wind indicator mounted on the outer end of the upper boom).
 
Nice video and nice sailing! The no-go/no-sail zone is always about 90 degrees wide - 45 degrees on either side of the wind. It may have seemed wider as at least in the beginning your sail looked like it wasn’t sheeted in enough to truly be going upwind at 45 degrees to the wind.

A big congrats on such great improvement!
 
I very much enjoyed this video. Beautiful day, beautiful boat and beautiful setting. One thing to be careful of is when your daggerboard is up and extends above the lower boom, you need to keep a good eye on it. If the wind shifts, it can run the boom/sail into the top of the daggerboard, stop the sail and over you go. Had that happen a couple of times. I really liked watching this and may have to figure out how to post videos. I have some really nice footage of sailing my Oldfish in Wisconsin last summer.

Thanks! Yeah, it's a great lake. Too bad it's so tough to get to. Good call on the daggerboard. When I was out there I actually noticed that and made the assumption that if it's up when the wind pushes the sail over, I'd be in for a bad time, so I made sure to keep an eye on that.

You should make some videos! Older gopros are cheap and with the right editing software, you'll be on your way. It's a lot of fun, plus you'll always have video of your trips so it's well worth it.

Looks good. Get a piece of cassette tape and tie it to a clip on the lower boom in front of the pulley. Simple wind indicator. Get a shock cord from one side of the boat to the other behind the center board. It will help hold the board in the trunk if you tip over.

I have telltales on my sail, but oddly enough I seemed to go faster when ignored them than going by what they were telling me. And yeah, I definitely have to come up with a way to make sure the centerboard stays in. I'm liking your bungie idea.

Great video Guybrush3pwood. A little bit creepy that Will Smith would be spying on you like that (You'd think he has better things to do.) It looks like you have a ratchet block mounted to the lip of the cubby for the mainsheet. Is that right? I agree with you, the Sunfish can be a real blast. What camera equipment do you use and how is it mounted? Would love to see more videos.

I have this style of block. However, it doesn't currently work and I need to replace it with something better.

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I've got what I call a faux pro on the boom (a chinese knock off named ThiEYE) held on using the hat-brim mount and some zip ties. I've got a gopro hero 3+ on the bow with a suction cup mount, and I did plan on a gopro hero session 4 on the mast with the large bar mount, but despite being the larger bar mount, it still didn't fit, so I think I'm going to use the bar mount on the boom and figure out another way to set up a third angle. Maybe just the session on a selfie stick type setup.

An alternative is to tape a stiff zip tie to the end of the upper boom and attach the cassette tape there. I find that there is a lot of turbulence close to the boat giving misleading wind indications (though it is easier to look at a wind indicator on the lower boom than craning your neck back to see a wind indicator mounted on the outer end of the upper boom).

Great idea! I have some telltales on my sail, but listening to them just seemed to make me go slower as opposed to going by pure feeling and adjusting. I'll need to play around with that next time I go out so I can figure that all out a bit more.

Nice video and nice sailing! The no-go/no-sail zone is always about 90 degrees wide - 45 degrees on either side of the wind. It may have seemed wider as at least in the beginning your sail looked like it wasn’t sheeted in enough to truly be going upwind at 45 degrees to the wind.

A big congrats on such great improvement!

Thanks! Couldn't have done it without the gracious advice you've given since the very start of my adventures. Heck, had I not listened to your advice to pass on Otisco, I'd probably STILL be stuck on that rock wall. Lol
 
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Wow - this brought back so many memories of sailing and learning the basics - great, great video. You made it out, and you made it back and you learned along the way!!
But...the best part was the video and I encourage you to do more, as you were smart, funny and totally "approachable" we could use more of this
Thank you
 

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