Replace mainsheet cam cleat with hexaratchet?

Offramp

New Member
Getting my new to me 73 Sunfish ready for racing. I am looking to replace the mainsheet cam cleat with a ratchet block like the Harkin H019 or H2625 Harkin CarboRatchamatic or Ronstan RF6100 60 MM Ratchet.
What do I need to attach these ratchets to the deck? Eyestrap and stand up spring?
Which eyestrap? Vanguard V79460? Other?
Does one eystrap fit the three ratchets
Which stand up spring(s)? H071? Other?
Sorry for so many questions. :confused: I've never modified my daysailing boats and just used them as they were.
I am looking forward and anxious to any and all of your help and suggestions.
 
I think you can just measure the overhang and find an eyestrap that will fit it. Don't forget a backing plate. Also, make sure the block you use will handle the 3/8" mainsheet as I think the harken carbo might be a little small? Last, you could just use the HAR019 ratchet with standup spring and then attach cam cleats to each side of your boat so you can uncleat the sheet without having to come centerline to pop it unless you will use your forward foot or you have a might powerful and efficient wrist snap. Good luck.
 
I used the "small" (57mm?)Harken CarboRachamatic(love it), and instead of a stand up spring, I used the plastic "boot" sold by APS (in grey or black)
 
On those old style boats that had a hook I buy a stainless eyestrap and bolt it onto the place where the "hook" was originally mounted. Personally, I don't like the spring because I have had it bind up too many times. Having the ratchet block flop around has proved easier for me to just jerk on to pull out those times the mainsheet gets overwrapped.
 
Hi guys Im going to West Marine tomorrow to get a ratchet. Can anyone show me in the right direction as to what I need to buy to mount this thing? I just took off the old cam tonight and it has 3 little holes now. Please anyone. Also does anyone got any ideas on the best ratchet for my buck that WM will have?
 
If you can put a piece of paper over the holes and rub a pencil over it, you can take it along to the shop to purchase an adequate strap or base to attach the block to. Hexaratchet is the Harken product. Depending on your fitness and strength you can choose between the small and large one. In a big blow, I wouldn't be without the large one. I have both but lately have not bothered with the small one. I like the on/off for the ratchet on the large one because it cannot be accidentally slipped into the off position in heavy breezes which happened too often with the small one in my experience.

Other company's products do a good job, too. I'm just partial to Harken because of their ongoing support to collegiate sailing and one design sailing and because they stand behind their products. Great engineering!
 
Get the 019 Harken ratchet block, a Harken stand up spring, an eye strap, two nylon stop nuts and two bolts for the eye strap, and two fender washers (LARGE washers) to keep the eye strap bolts from pulling thru the deck. Now you're all set.

Fred
 
I switched just the same this winter. I used Gail's method of "trace and match" for my eyestrap type. I placed a small 1.5"x2"x1/8" plate of ABS plastic on my deck ( as a damper and weight distribution) and an 1/8" plate of aluminum (most of the pulling load is here) under my deck. I used two bolts from my eyestrap to hold the harken 019. I used the H071 spring too. Yes my clamcleat base left me with a third hole too. I just droped an third bolt and lock nut thru my plate on the deck to the plate on my underside versus filling the hole with epoxy. You will be so impressed with the hexaratchet versus how you sailed with clamcleats. Best upgrade ever!
 
Do you mean a backing plate under the deck? If so, you sure as heck need one!
If it's a base plate on the deck under the eyestrap, it's optional.
Fred
 
West Marine sells "fender" washers which are large washers that will work.
You need one for each bolt. The forces on the block and eye strap are large when hauling in the sheet in heavy air.

Fred
 
Yes the plate on the deck is optional. I used a plastic or vinyl 1/8" plate to cover my three holes above deck. Purely cosmetic. The working weight distribution during the pull of heavy air is from below the deck much like a molly or toggle bolt works on drywall. The larger, wider plate below the deck lip helps distribute the pull-out load over more fiberglass surface. Thus, a stronger load can me carried without your deck giving way. We are not talking of extreme loads here since you can hold your mainsheet in your hand during a good blow without a rachet ot the "hook". But over a long sail your hands would tire. I have a 1.5" x 4" x1/8" aluminum plate under my deck to support my hexarachet.
 
When people refer to putting a backing plate "under the deck" are they actually referring to the lip around the forward part of the cockpit? I too am considering a replacement of the original hook and from memory (the boat is actually on a lake two and a half hours away so I can't just go take a look) the hook is attached through the lip. Am I remembering incorrectly or am I misinterpreting others comments about "through the deck"?
 
I know this sounds crazy but I actually took the hook off the boat, used those holes and made one a little wider to match the holes for the ratchets, lined them up and bolted it in. Now IM using the sunfish hook as my backing plate (this is what happens when one does not have his license yet!! haha)


Kevin
 
Yes, reference to a backing plate is for a plate (or large washers) under the lip of the cockpit.
Using the old hook position is a little awkward and lets the block flop around so most sailors mount the block on the deck over the lip. The lip is strong but the bolts for the block could pull out of the lip without a backing plate or large washers to distribute the load.

Fred
 
Here is a photo from the Sunfish Sailor Forum showing the old holes left from the original "hook" removed and the new ratchet (Harken 019) mounted "thru the deck". The rachet is held vertical by the stand up spring (Harken H071). The aluminum or stainless steel backing plated is under the deck, behind the lip where the holes thru the deck allow the mounting bolts to pass thru and be attached.
 

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What a great use for the hook! The only other use I've had is to make a plaque for a "Hanger's On" award, given to those helpful people who don't sail or race but are always around the club, helping out, make things viable, and are great to have around. Screw the hook onto the plaque and have a plate made up and it's a nice award. Good for holding keys, too!
 
Repete,

Glad you have found the picture useful on both forums. Maybe this shot will be larger and clearer.

All,

Here is a view most people don’t get to see very often. Photo 1 is the bottom side of the ratchet block using 1” diameter SS Fender washers and has held up well in winds 20+ mph. Photo 2 is the same set up with a 1/8” x 1-1/2” x 4” aluminum plate added to spread the load over a wider area. I will probably bed the plate in an epoxy/filler bed for better load transfer (similar to the rudder backer plate).
 

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Many thanks SuperCub,
Thank you for the views from below the lip. I could not find one and was contemplating photographing my own. I also took your advice for the aluminum backer plate. The epoxy idea sounds to be a better transfer of the loads too. For now, friction between the plate and the under deck are working for this season.

Your photos and descriptions of repairs and upgrades are very valuable to both forums. Thank you.:)
 
I am sooooo glad I removed my AMF-Alcort cam cleat and replaced it with a Harkin 2625 57mm Carbo Ratchmatic :) Last Saturday the winds got stronger after each race and by the 4th race I was really really really pleased with the ratchet block versus the cam cleat.
However I have a problem. My sister gets to use my boat for recreation sailing and she, like me, has 30 years experience with a cam cleat for holding the main sheets. When she sails now she is usually out with one of her dogs and probably a canned beverage and uses a cleat to hold the sheet most of the time. So in order to help her I need to make some provisions for her to cleat in I have three ideas and ask for your comments (pro or con) and any other recommendations.
One thought I have is to remove the eyestrap and ratchet block and install the cam cleat for her. Then make the switch back for me.
Another is to add something like a Harken 205 swivel block with cam cleat to the ratchet block. She would then have a cam cleat to use while I hopefully could pass the sheet through the cam cleat support arm thus avoiding the cam cleat.
And the thrid choice is to add two clam cleats.
 
Fourth choice: deck mounted cam cleats near the ratchet.

Fifth choice (and cheap!): sister puts a loop knot into mainsheet in approximate location of choice for appropriate trim. A quick jerk on it pulls the loop out for adjustment. I do this all the time as I don't have cleats!
 
Offramp,
I have seen a boat set up like this photo off of the Sunfish Sailor Forum photo files. If I remember right they had trouble getting the base removed from the hull so the cams and bracket were left. I thought of this photo as you decribed your options for a solution to share with your sister.
(one additional option, speaking as a little brother to my sister is.......... costly yes for your sister that is, would be for her to buy her own boat......LOL:rolleyes:
 
Offramp,

Gail's sisters trick is the cheapest. If you must put cleats in, I would go with the clam cleat on the front corners of the cockpit. And don't for get the wedges under the cleats to keep the mainsheet aligned with the ratchet. A simple pull and lift will release the mainsheet.
 
Yes, and seriously, Gail has a great detail of using the simple knot. Here is the photo I missed attaching in an earlier response.
 

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If you go with side cam or clam cleats they need to be spaced as far apart as possible for them to be through bolted into the cockpit lip.
AND angled blocks or riser blocks will be neccessary as the angle of the sheet from the ratchet to the cleat will be severe enough to allow the sheet to pull free and be very hard to clamp.
Been there, done it, learned the lesson the hard way.
 
Repete,
What size eyestrap did you use to fit into the existing holes of the swiveling camcleat. I have the same on my boat and want to replace it with the harken carbo ratchomatic. Also, where did you get the aluminum backing plate and plastic?

Thanks

Janina
 
Janina, the photo I used as an example is not my rig. I borrowed that photo from the Sunfish Sailor forum files. My rigging is the same as post #19, the photo, which again is not my rig. I completely removed the whole swivel base and just have the stand up spring and eyestrap on top of an 1/8" rectangle of ABS. I do have the aluminum bar stock below the deck lip too. I bought my scraps from a recycling yard here in Kalamazoo, Mich. Home Depot and other big box stores carry 1/4" aluminum bar, but you will have to buy just a little more than you need. As for the ABS plastic piece it is purely cosmetic. It covers the halo, circle, left from the old swivel base for me. A piece of vinyl, flat stock from some siding, trim, tupperware lid,etc. would work too. Good luck.
 
I knew you removed the swivel base. I was just wondering what size eyestrap you got that allowed you to use the existing holes in the deck from the swivel base. I just placed the order and I got the Harken H281 Micro eyestrap. I also ordered the medium standup boot from APS and the carbo ratchamatic. I'm looking forward to switching to the ratchet block after sailing under heavy wind on Friday with the stupid cam cleat and no block. I thought my arms were going to fall off from holding the sheet and the sheet accidentally cleated itself several times and almost tossed me in. :)
 
Sorry Janina:(, I did mention that in my earlier post, I should read what I have written. I did use the H281 eyestrap (I measured my holes and compared hole to hole spacing among the eyestraps available. I also used the 071 spring and not the boot. Is the boot a cover for the spring or is there a spring with the boot or within the rubber of the boot or does the rigidity of the rubber act as a spring? I think this was the best upgrade to my boat yet. I agree with your frustration of getting dunked in the drink to many times with cleats.;)

Happy Sailing (now)~~~~~~~~~~/)~~~~~~~~~:)
 
I've used the spring before when I had a laser. It works ok but as others have said, sometimes the mainsheet gets stuck on it. MY understanding is that the rubber boot acts like a spring. We'll see when I get it :)
I'm hoping that the eyestrap will work for mine because frankly I was just too lazy to go out and remove the swivel cam to measure the holes and then I have to put it back on so I can still sail until the new clock comes. So I'm hoping that they are pretty standard. If not, should be easy to get a different eyestrap somewhere local...
 
Janina, if the eyestrap is just a hair short or long on your existing holes, you can "wow" or enlarge your hole with the same diameter drill bit as the hole. Use a set of top and bottom stainless steel washers, fender or standard to cover the gap as well as the cosmetic fix too. If you have to make a big adjustment, epoxy your current hole closed and redrill a new one where needed. The aluminum bar below the deck will transfer and spread the loads to additional areas of the fiberglass and not entirely at the holes.
 

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