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Questions about Toe Rails and Association legal replacements

Pingpro

New Member
Hi all,
I am new to j/24's and recently purchased hull #3205 (1982) and it needs a few repairs to be water ready. One are the toe rails. I initially thought I'd go with PVC but $840 for a set of plastic toe rails seems crazy... (Waterline Systems). I'm also looking into artificial wood (kinda like Trex Decking), I found a company that would custom fabricate them for me and has done toe rails before. I'm also looking into slotted aluminum as it would be durable and great for attaching things to it. I am wondering if either of the last two options would make the boat class illegal. I don't plan to race it in class races, but don't want to reduce resale value down the road. I don't know what either option would cost yet, but before pursuing, I figured I'd check on legality.

Also does anyone have the actual specs on the toe rails? Length of each section and width at bottom, top and height?

Many thanks,
Christian
 

Thomas Anthony

New Member
Not being a rule's expert I can't comment on the legality issue. Common sense might say if this was a 5,000 series boat sailed by a top caliber crew in a highly visible OD National/Worlds event and it was perceived that the modification in some way enhanced the boat's performance, then perhaps yes it might be subject to protest. At a local/regional level though I would not think this would draw ire.
In terms of valuation, any mod from standard is not likely to add value. That said, the vintage you own is typically not very expensive, so can't imagine a huge loss of value due to the mod although it may make it less saleable. Toe rails are pretty resilient though, is there some localized issue like a collision that could perhaps just have a small portion of the teak rail replaced? I know my rails were pretty weathered and gray when I purchased the boat, but through cleaning, sanding and 8-10 coats of varnish were able to be resorted to like new condition. Just my 2 cents and as they say YMMV.......
 

Pingpro

New Member
Not being a rule's expert I can't comment on the legality issue. Common sense might say if this was a 5,000 series boat sailed by a top caliber crew in a highly visible OD National/Worlds event and it was perceived that the modification in some way enhanced the boat's performance, then perhaps yes it might be subject to protest. At a local/regional level though I would not think this would draw ire.
In terms of valuation, any mod from standard is not likely to add value. That said, the vintage you own is typically not very expensive, so can't imagine a huge loss of value due to the mod although it may make it less saleable. Toe rails are pretty resilient though, is there some localized issue like a collision that could perhaps just have a small portion of the teak rail replaced? I know my rails were pretty weathered and gray when I purchased the boat, but through cleaning, sanding and 8-10 coats of varnish were able to be resorted to like new condition. Just my 2 cents and as they say YMMV.......
Hi Thomas,
Thanks for the reply and information, all real good points. I agree that based on the overall value of the boat, it doesn't really matter too much. I never really considered trying to repair/restore them. I think I could get away with restoring the one on the transom, but most are too far gone (pictures attached). I'm a newish sailor and don't really plan to race in anything bigger than the local sailing club. I'll probably just go with PVC.
Thanks Again and Stay Warm,
Christian
 

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Thomas Anthony

New Member
Yeah they do look like they have seen better days/time to replace. I would say this, always remember the up front discount given when you purchased the boat, i.e. you probably saved 50k plus or minus, so that should take some of the sting off the price of toe rail replacement. I had to replace the cabin sole in mine (about $400-500 in materials for the new teak and holly, west system, varnish, etc.) in addition to other basic stuff like all new running rigging, sails, etc., but still when I look at the all in price, I think they are pretty economical 24 ft. boats that happen to sail pretty well (given their vintage).
 

Jott19

New Member
I made new ones for mine last year. Got a 9' plank (longest rail is 97" IIRC, others are 88 & 76 ish, plus 54 across transom) of teak for $210 CAD locally (was way too wide at 9" but I used the rest to replace missing companionway trim and some missing interior, still have some). I reproduced the profile with my table saw, relieved the edges with a hand plane. They took the shape without needing steam bending. It took me a day.

Finished them in west 105/207 and covered that with Epiphanes. I'll see how long they stay pretty.

Zero maintenance plastic has it's appeal but agreed that WL prices are uneconomical. Yours look slightly more shot than mine, probably have not been touched in some time.

Legally, you have to use the same materials as built, though you're allowed to use late-model substitutions like the plastic rails, trim and the sealed buoyancy tanks. Trex might be a tough sell but someone here or on SA probably knows exactly the material that waterline uses, custom made out of that would be fine. It may be starboard (HPDE) or PVC.

As above, for local use, no one will care, unless you really piss someone off. Where I am, no measurement cert is needed, though they want you to keep your class association registration current if you're taking part in a series. If you're just cruising around, then anything goes.

I futzed around with using some other wood for a bit but my local wood dealer had nice teak planks and only smalls of most other timbers, so I wound up original. :)

Cheers,
Derek
 

ProATC

Active Member
Jott19, sounds like you are quite the woodworker, and good on you, wish I was and had the right tools. Ever thought of duplicating what you made and sell them? I don't want to mess with taking out and re-installing the 100+ bolts holding in the existing rails either. My rails (1980 vintage boat) do not have any exposed bolts, wood plugs are still in as well, but has wear for sure. I was thinking of using ART's Flex-Easy Marine Flexible Epoxy Repair System to float a coat over the existing rails, and to beef them back up to original size using a jig/form to run over the top to screed off the excess material. I wonder if anyone has ever tried this, even with another product? This epoxy system looks really durable (online videos), and gelatinous enough that it would take and hold shape. I know there is a moldable putty that you can use as well, but that seems a little expensive compared to a tube of this or any epoxy. Once I get around to trying this on one rail, I will post about it on here for sure.
 
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