Laser Simulator available at Tacticat

tacticat

Member
Hi all,
This is to announce the general availability of Lasers at Tacticat (www.tacticat.com) . Tacticat is an internet simulator for tactical training intended for race around the buoys. Tacticat has been created and tested by sailors that race often and supported by various official sailing organizations.

Tacticat is in fact a multi-user game where sailors meet, race, and learn. A big effort has been made to re-create the conditions of an around-the-buoys race, trying to face the users with the same tactical questions they would normally find in reality (which plan for the start, tack now or wait?, take the risk and what if wind changes?, boat-to-boat tactics, etc).

Tacticat was born for fast catamarans, now a new boat can be sailed, the Laser. Laser sim is based on the boat polars, acceleration and shape and has incorporated the planning effect and by-the-lee sailing to the previous cat-sailing simulation.

To sail Tacticat you don’t need to be registered. Just enter and try. Register is only required for those willing to have a boat named after his nick or wanting to keep the points for classifications.

Any of you interested to give it a try?, please go to www.tacticat.com, and take a look to the Read-me-first and the FAQ. Just remember that Tacticat is been designed for simplicity and minimum key input. You will be a coach radio linked with the boat skipper, you are not at the helm, your orders will be: navigate by telltales! (space bar), tack! (enter), gybe! (enter) or, less often Up! or off! (arrow keys).

Tacticat is a java application with NO USAGE of user system resources and running in a Java sand-box. The only requirement to play is to have an updated version of Java (downloadable from www.java.com or www.sun.com). Internet connection is also a requirement, the game is playable even with 56k modem lines or satellite connections, but don’t expect very good response times in those cases.
Tacticat servers are located in Dallas (USA) and London , managed by a New-Zealand company and administered by Spanish sailors.

Support and questions can be e-mailed directly to tacticat-at-adecat.com (change the at by @).

All sailors are welcome, even those sailing big boats. We wait you at the races…

Amando Estela, Tacticat admin and Laser sailor when younger.
 
One day after the announcement of the Laser availability at Tacticat ( http://www.tacticat.com ) and a lot of sailors have entered the races :)

A couple of comments:
- It took us 2 months to get the Catamaran simulation right, to the level where world top sailors use it to improve their tactics. We used lots of inputs to change the behaviour of the boat and tweak everywhere. For the Laser we will need it too, please, we need your comments to get a Laser sim that satisfies top sailors and novices.

- The original post has been moved by this forum admin (I assume) to the Chit-Chat section about everything. The post was Laser related, ONLY Laser, and for interest of laser racers, a pity :(, but that's the admin job, isn't it?.

At Tacticat, we would like the Lasers be like it is today for cats:
- A tool, good for newbies and pros
- A way to know and race other Laser sailors around the world
- A way to introduce the Laser class to other sailors now sailing other types of boats.

With your help, of course.

aestela
Tacticat Admin.
 
It's nice. You like. Hi five!
I fiddled around with it a few times and I think it's a great tool for learning not only tactics, but for newbies it's going to make the learning curve rise sharply in the areas of following courses, the racing rules, and not beat up any real boats in the process. (Personally, I like gybing in heavy air and NOT capsizing! Take your time adding a capsize/turtle feature.)
A few features/tweaks I'd like to see:
-a different finish sound. Any way to change the windows ring-ring with a whistle or horn?
-variation of course. Is it possible to run a variety of O, G, and W courses? If so, I guess there'd also need to be a way to display what course is being raced. Maybe a "virtual RC boat stanchion"?
-I don't know if it's my PC (it's pretty fast and on a hi speed connection), but the up/down arrow control for the mainsheet seems sluggish.
-and somewhere down the line, a wave/current feature. Now, that would be hot!
I know I need to probably read up more on the nuances, like what's it mean when boatnames are highlighted in various ways, etc. I appreciate its availability and think it's a great tool for learning and having fun. Now, we can go sailing whenever it's snowing, sleeting, freezing, hurricaning....working, bored in conference meetings, riding the bus, baby-sitting, or any of the other times we are not actually on the water. I'd be curious to know if anybody unconsciously leans out in gusts or shifts their weight while steering while using Tacticat. :rolleyes:
See you on Tacticat sometime...
 
Hey Tacticat - thanks for getting a Laser sim up! You guys rock.

I haven't given't it a try but will as soon as I get some time.
 
odinsvitskjaldr said:
It's nice. You like. Hi five!
I fiddled around with it a few times and I think it's a great tool for learning not only tactics, but for newbies it's going to make the learning curve rise sharply in the areas of following courses, the racing rules, and not beat up any real boats in the process.
Exactly one of the intended goals of Tacticat

odinsvitskjaldr said:
-a different finish sound. Any way to change the windows ring-ring with a whistle or horn?
Not possible. Tacticat uses Java technology that for security reasons CANNOT access the users' resources, that includes your filesystems, microphone and speaker. That is a guarantee Tacticat is not going to fiddle with your machine but problem is the only sound we are allowed to use is the BEEP.

odinsvitskjaldr said:
-variation of course. Is it possible to run a variety of O, G, and W courses? If so, I guess there'd also need to be a way to display what course is being raced. Maybe a "virtual RC boat stanchion"?
We will do it, but just right now we're trying to cope with the flood of Laser Sailors (you are too many!!;) ). We are adjusting the servers and comms to try to satisfy 10 times the hits we had when we sailed only cats. Give us some time.

-
odinsvitskjaldr said:
I'd be curious to know if anybody unconsciously leans out in gusts or shifts their weight while steering while using Tacticat. :rolleyes:
See you on Tacticat sometime...
One of the things you learn soon is that Tacticat interface (your screeen and keyboard) is just a way to give orders and indications to a remote skipper. You are the coach, the boat is sailed by a world champion (who makes the hiking:) for you). So... Tacticat will only help in a small part of Laser Sailing, nothing compares to the real experience.
 
Any chance for better control keys?
It looks like the keys use the system timed key repeat (I'm on mac os x), so you hit turn and hold it, and it turns once, waits, then turns a bunch, making it really hard to steer accurately and smoothly around marks.
Also, Maybe having the chat/message input in a separate window rather than on-screen, perhaps it'd make the typing smoother?

Great simulator, I love it... Looks like tons of laser sailors are playing with it, therew ere around 10 on yesterday, and 16 this morning... That's a lot considering other network games :)

Keep it up,
-Mark H
 
Which is the best race course?

Help!.
At Tacticat Lasers race a course that was defined long time ago for cats.

Many sailors have complained and want the course changed so, taking into account that
  • WE NEED A SHORT COURSE,
  • we need a course where tactical decisions are of importance
what would be your preference?

Thank you for your comments,

aestela
Tacticat Admin
 
I started trying but saw it was downloading and running a .exe file without having asked my permission. Despite having high security settings on my computer it seemed to just download and run this so I immediately pulled the plug (literally) and then spend some time recovering what I had lost (other things that had been open on my computer !!).

Not impressed and will not be using it again.

Ian
 
Exe file executing is either Microsoft or Sun Microsystems Java. You can or cannot trust them.
Downloaded files are the Tacticat java classes that will be loaded by java with all security managers on.

Of course system is NOT asking you permissions: That's because Tacticat explicitly runs on a sand box and is not able to fiddle with your system!.

For instance
- Tacticat cannot even store a cookie in your system (web browsing can)
- Tacticat cannot use your microphone, cannot use your speaker (only a poor system beep is allowed)

But of course you have to trust someone, Microsoft if you use Windows OS and windows applications, Sun if you use java. If you trust them (and I guess you do) you dont need to trust Tacticat to use it.

Tacticat don't want you to install an exe file, or download whatever file. Miscrosoft and Sun technologies will do it, and will try to do it and keep you safe.

Of course even MS or Sun make mistakes and those can be exploited by hackers. That risk you are always with the moment you connect your computer to Internet.

aestela
Tacticat Admin.
 
Deimos said:
I started trying but saw it was downloading and running a .exe file without having asked my permission.

What was the name of the file? It sounds like it was probably your computer dowloading the latest java to be able to play the game. Many computers don't have it installed by default. What web browser are you using?
 
Re: Which is the best race course?

vtgent49 said:
Here is a link to the NA Laser

I've tried the link several times to download a word doc. It opens always but immediatly hangs the Word. Should I keep trying to open the doc or is corrupted?

Thanks.
 
Re: Which is the best race course?

Sorry, but it just worked again for me. I'll try to attach the word.doc, otherwise email me, and I'll send it. Just click my name to email.
 

Attachments

  • RegattaGuidelinesv13[1].doc
    157 KB · Views: 76
Re: Which is the best race course?

Thanks. It worked.

After a first reading I noticed that all recommended finishes are on a windward leg. Is it only because a downwind finish makes it complicated for juries to read the sail numbers or there are other reasons?

At tacticat we use downwind finish. It makes finish more 'interesting' both for cats (big blanketting effects allow for nice tactics) and for current laser sim with the planning/non-planning effects.

And, of course, we have no problems reading sail numbers ;)
A.
 
I already have the latest Java stuff (manually downloaded and installed before trying the tacticat stuff. Cannot remember the name of the file as it downloaded pretty quickly before starting (i.e. much too quickly for it to be part of the Java system). It was definitely a .exe file though.
I installed the Java I downloaded form Sun (i.e. not the one that happened to be on my PC when I purchased it).

My IE is pretty "closed" in that most of the security options are enabled (i.e. not just default) and I'm on IE7 (so even pasting from the clipboard into the browser requires my permission.

Ian
 
Deimos said:
Cannot remember the name of the file as it downloaded pretty quickly before starting (i.e. much too quickly for it to be part of the Java system). It was definitely a .exe file though.

According to Sun documentation, the exe that is launched is javaws.exe

When a web browser indentifies the content sent by a server as being jnlp (that's the case of Tacticat application) if the java handler is registered (as it is by default with the new versions of MS Internet Explorer) javaws is launched and the content is forwarded to the exe.

javaws is, from that on, in charge of the process:
- checking what has to be executed
- checking that all required classes have been downloaded and download those that have been changed or ar missing verifying the timestamps and signatures on the fly.
- run the classes on a sand-box if the code is not signed (tacticat case) forbidding all access to user resources and all further connection to other servers except the server sending the content.

All in all the safest we have found. And even in this case, to be completely honest: nothing nor nobody can guarantee complete security when you connect to Internet. :(
 
Re: Which is the best race course?

Yes, Laser RC's prefer the short W leg to finish because the sail number is visable.

It also does have have tactical advantages, passing the advantage back to the leaders, who can use match racing tactics to cover, etc. The follower also has the opportunity to get an inside overlap at the last leeward.

The windward/leeward course is used quite often, especially if there is only one fleet. With two big fleets, the RC's will designate the second start to use the left hand marks for their extra w/l lap. This seperates them.

I'm sure you simulator will be great either way. Thanks for your efforts.

Al Russell 182797
 
I feel like the tacticat program is probably safe to run. Of course, one should always make sure his/her anti-virus and anti-spyware software is functioning properly when running any program off the internet. As of right now, I haven't seen any thing to suggest tacticat has malicious intent.

Bests,
 
Ok I had a play last night. It's clunky to use and very frustrating rounding marks, but the top guys seem to have no trouble so I guess there is a knack I still have to learn.

It's still a lot of fun though and well worth playing.

Some suggestions:

More oscillating wind patterns - the wind could shift a lot more, which would allow more exciting racing.

Disbale swearing in the chat window. There seems to be a lot of people without a profile "Guest_XX" that just sail around the course being abusive. Some way of forcing people to only race under a profile would be better. That way they could be reported, and they would at least be a little more responsible with their language.

Well done on getting it this far, good luck with future developments.
 
rock steady said:
Ok I had a play last night. It's clunky to use and very frustrating rounding marks, but the top guys seem to have no trouble so I guess there is a knack I still have to learn.
Tacticat interface is SIMPLE. Keys are orders from you (the coach) to the skipper (a super-top sailor). That simplicity is nice for most of times but rounding boys is not one of them.
We evaluated that a standard user will require 10 minutes to get the basic handling, perfect roundings require a little more :eek:


rock steady said:
More oscillating wind patterns - the wind could shift a lot more, which would allow more exciting racing.
Wind shiftiness is a random function that can be parametrized by admin. Old tacticat sailors were used to cats, where shifts are of lesser importance and we're adjusting. Suggestion noted.


rock steady said:
Disbale swearing in the chat window.
That's a tough one. A poll has been started by your comment. Let's see what the community says.
I personnally would enforce strict-no-swearing policies, punishing those not abiding. But take into acccount that:
- Tacticat is multi-lingual, after 6 months I've learnt gross words in English, French, German, Finnish, Polish and Hebrew :D .
- One of the features of Tacticat is the possibility for sailors to be anonymous, that makes possible new sailors to try without registering and olympic champions to sail not risking their status... And anonimity means also that no action can be done seriously against them if they don't behave.

rock steady said:
Well done on getting it this far, good luck with future developments.
Getting the cat sim right took us 2 or three months. After 15 days of Laser sailing there are already a lot of things that require change. A new version is due.

And thanks for your comments,
aestela-
 
I personnally would enforce strict-no-swearing policies, punishing those not abiding. But take into acccount that:
- Tacticat is multi-lingual, after 6 months I've learnt gross words in English, French, German, Finnish, Polish and Hebrew :D .
- One of the features of Tacticat is the possibility for sailors to be anonymous, that makes possible new sailors to try without registering and olympic champions to sail not risking their status... And anonimity means also that no action can be done seriously against them if they don't behave.


Whats wrong with a little passion? I know plenty of poeple who enjoy to a little clourfull language on the course so why not on a simulator?
 
We at Tacticat want to thank the Laser Forum, and all laser sailors that have joined Tacticat and our races. Now the number of countries represented are more than 30 and it is usual to have more than 20 boats at the start line.

Next month we will start with team races, each team representing a country or other group of people or community. We expect many sailors from The Laser Sailing Comunity.

A notice has been posted on Tacticat home page with a direct link to the forum.

Tacticat.
 
End of Jannuary we will be sailing team races at Tacticat.

So far 13 teams are being discussed (USA, CANADA, several UK, France, several Spanish, ITALIA, and other mixed teams.).

Members of The Laser Community are entering the races but there's no specific team with that name. The due date to have all teams defined is Jan 14, we will have a couple of days to define the races format and the regattas will be held during the end of January and possibly first week of Feb.

Those of you willing to enter can apply for one of the already defined teams or just create a new one. Teams require 6-8 sailors.

aestela
Tacticat Admin.
 
Tacticat National Championships will be held during Mars and April.

So far only Canada is scheduled for Tue Mars 13, 10pm Eastern Canadian Time. Countries with more than 6 active sailors are or will be discussing when to schedule their nationals.

Tacticat Nat. Championships format: 6 races (2 lasers + 2 skiffs + 2 cats) with only one dropout.

aestela
Tacticat Admin
 
Last months have seen big changes in Tacticat (http://www.tacticat.com) environment:

- Currents have been added. The strngth a bit exaggerated (as everything in Tacticat, I'd say) making for interesting starts and roundings.

- We do have now especialized Match Race fields with the specific ruling and start procedures

- A new communication protocol between the users machines and the server is in place to allow for better intersailors communications. It is common to see fleets with 20+ boats

- Now we have Lasers, Catamarans, Skiffs and Big boats ( a la americas cup) and the races format are fleets, teams and match race.

- Replays have been added for the users to analyze the race and see which rues were in play.

Till the end of 2007 we're running the first euro team league, 20 teams (of 3 or 4 boats) representing different sailing clubs from european countries race to win a couple of boats for their club (not a laser this time, but that can change in the furure).

That's all, if you wanna give a try .... http://www.tacticat.com

aestela
Tacticat Admin
 
Tacticat

What a garbage game
would not reccomend to anyone unless you like
a) being harrased by racsist characters
b) not obeying racing rules of sailing
c)listen to people you dont know and will never know bad mouth you

all in all rubish dont play it
 
Re: Tacticat

What a garbage game
would not reccomend to anyone unless you like
a) being harrased by racsist characters
b) not obeying racing rules of sailing
c)listen to people you dont know and will never know bad mouth you

all in all rubish dont play it

Seriously? I have found the complete opposite to be true. Sure, there are a few annoying sailors but they are quickly shut down by the administrators. And, it's a tactical simulation, so people push the rules to see what they can get away with. That's how you can learn what works and what doesn't. The rules algorithms on Tacticat are actually very good. Perhaps you have been interpreting the rules incorrectly.
 
Please keep the discussion friendly, at least on this site. While I understand you may be trying to make a point about nasty talk on Tacticat, this is not the place to call people pieces of anything. It's a difficult task keeping people friendly and I'm sure the folks at Tacticat are doing their best.

PS: Tacticat Threads merged.


Thank you,
 
ps.

I like savana good waves i bet your a pro at waves ?
are you
if you are give me tips upwind in 20+ and waves
 
It's a difficult task keeping people friendly and I'm sure the folks at Tacticat are doing their best.

One of the things that Tacticat allows is for more senior users to mute the more junior users when they start getting nasty. It works quite well as a deterrent and most of the upstarts convert into friendly racers after a few weeks of experience.
 

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