Laser Fleet Questions

L

LuckyJack

Member
I am trying to re-invigorate the Laser Fleet at my sailing club. Currently we have about 30+ lasers in the boat park, however only get 5-6 regularly on the water. I am starting by putting together an online questionaire/survey to try and find out why they aren't sailing and why there boats are starting to resemble planters rather then dinghies (but obviously without the bluntness of such a question). Has anyone got any ideas on good questions I could ask? I was thinking along the lines of multiple choice questions for example

Q.How Often Do You Sail Your Laser Dinghy?
Answers ;-
A. Nearly every weekend
B. 1-2 Times a Month
C. Just in the Summer
D. I have a Laser Dinghy??

Q.Do you take part in club races?

......... and so on

Any ideas would be much appreciated.

Thanks

John
 
Whilst I agree that you need to find out why your boat owners are not sailing I am not sure an online questionaire is the way to go.

I know at Rutland the fleet captain personally called every Laser own in the clubs membership to find out what would encourage them to sail more (I am not sure what he found out, perhaps Deimos or Strangler can comment more as they are members of that club if my memory serves me correctly).

At Hunts I was fleet captain and getting in with the fleet was key. A lot of people had become disillusioned over the percieved advatages that other boats enjoyed (as around 1/2 of our racing is Handicap). If you can acheieve a critical mass, perhaps run league tables and maybe introduce an element of fun into the fleet then you may find the fleet will grow.

What is key is getting in touch and trying to get as many of your fleet together as possible. The Activate project that is being run LP and the RYA may help you on this, get in touch with your RYA RDO and he will be able to assist or try to get hold of Brett Cockayne who is the activate project co-ordinator (PM me if you want his details I have them somewhere).

We have gone from having 3 or 4 out of 42 to having number regularly in the teens for our fleet racing series. We orgainsed training and boat 'pimping' days with both the people who were at the front of the fleet and we then got a coach in for a more serious training day (funding is available from your RDO if you ask him nicely). What also helps is forging links with other local clubs (and not so local in our case).

Webmuppet may be along to comment as he sails at Alton Water and was involved in their Activate days.
 
(Not a member of Rutland), but I am a member of a couple of other clubs and have actually just left one club where the Laser fleet has now pretty well merged with the handicap fleet (virtually no Laser class racing and no class starts).

I agree with Jeffers. I think phone calls would be much more effective and with a few ideas to present to non-active sailors. Sort of "Would you find a few class training sessions helpful ?" and maybe "We were thinking of e.g. RNLI charity race ...", or a "Class championship day" maybe some weird "off-the-wall" things (mentioned before but a "chose your course and collect e.g. ribbons from buoys"). These are not things I personally go for but what you need to find is what your club members would go for. And much as I hate them, maybe ask about "Personal Handicap ..." (maybe you don't need to descend that far ... another discussion). If you get positive responses, check on constraints (e.g. some like to go away with family on Bank Holidays so it may be that scheduling something then would be a foregone failure). Make sure calls are positive e.g. "Would xxx interest you" rather than "why don't you turn-up any more" (the negative question is classing them as a now inactive member and more asking for a justification/explanation rather than trying to encourage them).

And if you find something to encourage a few more to turn-up for an event, make sure that the existing regulars do not behave as a clique and are friendly and involve others, etc.

I agree that an online questionnaire is not particularly useful. It will take some work but calling is far more worthwhile.

As things stand, depending on the current regulars and their ability you might risk losing a few more as there can be nothing more boring than traipsing round the marks each race knowing who will be ahead of you and who behind and you find yourself just going through the motions until you stop bothering to turn-up. Happened to me - I knew those in the fleet I stood no chance of catching and those I could beat easily and cold weather just to fulfil the pre-ordained finishing result each week (and with 3 people entering the race it really does become "going through the motions"). (Being realistic, gaining skill takes time and in small fleets with ranges of abilities things can become repetitive).

(Also, if you have 5-6 regulars I suspect you already know the answers to the question examples you gave above).

Ian
 
Good advice from the guys above. Lots of the information for the Activate Scheme is on the UKLA site http://www.laser.org.uk/base.php?SessionCRC=216787259&PageSelect=Activate and I know you can sign up for workshops at present.

I was fleet captain at my old club and the fleet had died. Myself and another laser member attended the activate days and tried to implement a few ideas. I came up against a lot of brick walls from the sailing committee so make sure you get them on board with anything you want to do.
Unfortunately I've given up on that club and changed clubs, loving the new club. Ironically their fleet captain was at the same activate day as me and its worked really well for them - 13 lasers out this Sunday and the fair weather lot haven't emerged yet!
 
Another thought(s)

Phone call and collect e-mails. Post race results quickly (on internet and via e-mail). The club I mainly sail at now is unbelievable in this regard (for all classes) and results are posted same day and e-mailed round to everybody next day. Club I have just left sort of managed to get some race results worked out and posted after several months (and that was handicap !!). With e-mailed results people are reminded they have missed a really good race (you could add a brief write-up to results "fabulous weather not often experienced in the UK ... we could not have asked for a better start to the series ... end of a fantastic series and everything to play for next week with the start of a new series"

Then with e-mail you cal let everybody know what event has been scheduled for when and ask to let you know if they can attend (easy to press a reply button) and send reminders (without becoming a Spam nuisance).

Ian
 
Good comment from Sailorchick about getting your committee on side. I had a battle with the committee at my club (and won) and they are now reaping the rewards or the work and ideas that came from that workshop.

The ideas are good and can work for any fleet (even a handicap fleet).

We had a total of 35 boats (mixed fleet not just Lasers) out for our March series last weekend. These numbers have been unheard of for many years.

Our club now also has a waiting list for berths which is another thing that has not happened for many years.
 
Glossop used the Activate days last year to kick start the Laser fleet - and it had good results. I'm one of three who bought Lasers on the back of the days and this year there are hopefully more training days for the fleet to keep the momentum going. I think time on the water away from the racing as a fleet is an excellent way of generating interest.
 
One aspect (probably more general that getting existing members out) and that is that it is so important that people are friendly and not cliquey.

A really clear example recently: I also love gliding (got license, etc.) and I have a gliding club half a mile down the road from me and I am not a member. I tend to go down looking to join a couple of times a year and leave feeling that I must have the plague or something (whereas other clubs are so friendly you visit and feel like you have been a member for years). And the club just down the road in now in financial problems as their income is inadequate .....

Making sure that somebody turning up (either a new member or a returning member) is included and made to feel welcome is very important. And that can be difficult as many clubs have well established cliques.

Ian
 
Dan LXIX said:
Glossop used the Activate days last year to kick start the Laser fleet - and it had good results. I'm one of three who bought Lasers on the back of the days and this year there are hopefully more training days for the fleet to keep the momentum going. I think time on the water away from the racing as a fleet is an excellent way of generating interest.
Click to expand...

What's an Activate day?
 
Merrily said:
What's an Activate day?
Click to expand...

Activate is a scheme being run by UKLA, Sport England etc. Lots more info on the UKLA website under the activate tab. www.laser.org.uk with aims of getting all those unused lasers in your clubs back on the water and increasing fleet numbers at clubs.

There are training days that fleet reps can go on (activate days) to learn all about the scheme and share ideas with others to grow there own laser fleets.
The scheme also includes guidance on how to repair old boats and discounted rates from LP for activated clubs.
 
I'm out there every weekend and I'm a busy guy. I don't understand why some days there are absolutely perfect conditions and we only have 15-20 std and 10-15 radials out there. On the extreme heavy air days we sometimes only have around 8 boats total. Our fleet has a parking lot full of mint lasers, probably around 60-100 lasers. I've noticed a drop off in participation in the last 2 years. Some say its the economy, but hey I've been absolutely screwed by the poor economy and I will do whatever it takes to make sure I can sail my laser on the weekend. A poor economy is no reason at all not to sail. I think laser sailing is really important for the mind and body, its one of the most powerful natural highs. I think you get it just from being out there even if you're not racing or coming in DFL.

A few of the regulars that are missing have moved on to college sailing and/or the US sailing team ect. I'm sure they will be back when they have a break.

Kids are also a reason why some people have dropped out, although I still see a few of the people who recently had kids making it out on the water. In my opinion you need to stay healthy to be able to take care of your kids, so go sailing!
 
laserxd said:
I'm out there every weekend and I'm a busy guy. I don't understand why some days there are absolutely perfect conditions and we only have 15-20 std and 10-15 radials out there. On the extreme heavy air days we sometimes only have around 8 boats total. Our fleet has a parking lot full of mint lasers, probably around 60-100 lasers. I've noticed a drop off in participation in the last 2 years. Some say its the economy, but hey I've been absolutely screwed by the poor economy and I will do whatever it takes to make sure I can sail my laser on the weekend. A poor economy is no reason at all not to sail. I think laser sailing is really important for the mind and body, its one of the most powerful natural highs. I think you get it just from being out there even if you're not racing or coming in DFL.

A few of the regulars that are missing have moved on to college sailing and/or the US sailing team ect. I'm sure they will be back when they have a break.

Kids are also a reason why some people have dropped out, although I still see a few of the people who recently had kids making it out on the water. In my opinion you need to stay healthy to be able to take care of your kids, so go sailing!
Click to expand...

I love how you can say ONLY 15-20 lasers, 10-15 radials. That would be awesome numbers to get out on any day! At my old club 2-3 lasers of any rig was the norm! Thankfully new club is 10+ regular.
Most clubs have loads of lasers that never move, my old club had about 60 in the boat park for example.
 
laserxd said:
I'm out there every weekend and I'm a busy guy. I don't understand why some days there are absolutely perfect conditions and we only have 15-20 std and 10-15 radials out there.
Click to expand...

Only have 15 - 20 Lasers, 10-15 Radials that would be an amazing turnout for any club up here in the North (I think we struggle getting that for open UKLA GP meetings). My club runs to handicap fleets (Fast PY<1099 and Slow PY>1099) and think on s decent Sunday would struggle to get that many boats out between them. The club has mostly Solo (8-10) & Scorpian (3-5) but they only ever sail handicap. The rest of the numbers are made up of the small Laser/Radial contingent, a Mirracle, the odd Oppi/Topper from time to time, a Blaze or 2 and even a CFly.
Seems from what people are saying that Handicap racing is the obstacle of any type of fleet. However if we pull away from the handicap fleets then we weaken them which could be unpopular with the club. It seems a ‘politically’ difficult situation to be in.
I think the main thing would be to try to get recognition as a club that sails particular classes. So you become the ‘Laser Class Club’ for the area and try and suck sailors in who might have sailed at other clubs which are orientated to other classes?
 
LuckyJack said:
Seems from what people are saying that Handicap racing is the obstacle of any type of fleet. However if we pull away from the handicap fleets then we weaken them which could be unpopular with the club. It seems a ‘politically’ difficult situation to be in.
Click to expand...

That was the situation in the club I have recently left. Basically that handicap fleet forced the Lasers to join then (rather than the other way round). Some series allow for a separate Laser fleet if a minimum number of Lasers turn-up for a race (i.e. as soon as there is a race with more than the threshold number of Lasers the results change to retrospectively remove Lasers from the handicap fleet and then continue as two separate fleets). But it is all still run as one start for everybody so you can still be messed-up by boats you are not racing against.

One idea, (though I am unsure if it is a good one) would be to have separate Laser results (so the club scores Lasers as part of the handicap fleet and maybe the Laser fleet captain runs his/her own set of results of Lasers only). Think about (or rather ask your fleet about) allowing rig swapping and thus score everybody as just "Lasers" (i.e. standard,radial and 4.7 (and even the special ultra large one if you have any)). I like rig swapping (for everybody, any age) but the most important thing is what your fleet thinks about it. Combining everything as a "Laser" will also make the fleet turn-out larger !!

It is a difficult balance about weakening the handicap fleet. I like Lasers because the races are on a much more even basis (i.e. I do badly because I am no good, not because the course suited people with spinnakers/jibs, my/their boat had better handicap, etc.). How much being with the handicap affects your own fleet depends on their reasons for sailing a Laser. Maybe ask when you call round because, if people do want fleet racing then being part of the handicap fleet could be killing your fleet (something to discuss with your committee ?).

Ian
 
we are lucky to have such a big fleet, at the same time there used to be 60 boats out there on the perfect days, so 15-20 is low for us. Don't get me wrong, 15-20 is still a ton of fun and we really have a great time every week. I'm just wondering where the other 40+ sailors are? There is somewhere around 60-100 lasers in the lot, you have to pay for the season to keep your boat in the lot, and even worse than that, there are about 10 lasers that seem to have been completely abandoned. If you don't have the current sticker on your boat they move them over to another spot. These aren't junky boats either, they are sort of in limbo because the club can't legally get rid of them and the people aren't going to pick them up.
 
laserxd said:
These aren't junky boats either, they are sort of in limbo because the club can't legally get rid of them and the people aren't going to pick them up.
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Allot of club I know have an abandoned boat policy. We sail on what is essentially a private lake and we have room to put dinghies all the way down as well as 'Solo row' next to the club house. There is a corner of the lake which seems to accumulate old boats from season to season.
 
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