Hello! Halyard, Mast, and Literature Recommendations, please

[Desultor]

Hi all,

With kids at 3 and 8 years old, and a love for sailing that's been dormant since a community college course in high school, and most recently taking a private lesson at Leeward Sailing Center in Long Beach, CA with a friend, we decided to nab a "ready to sail" 1973 Sunfish last weekend. Kid-approved sail color scheme, of course!

We had a blast yesterday!

So here's a couple initial questions for your collective wisdom:

1. Would you recommend buying a recreational line package from APS, or West Coast Sailing? Or best to just buy a separate halyard and daggerboard shock cord?
2. Any thoughts/recommendations on the mast hole? I thought perhaps inserting and securing a section of PVC would help, but perhaps it's unnecessary.
3. Is the Sunfish Bible worthwhile? Any other online or physical resources recommended for a beginner? I found Learn to Sail in 3 Days and the Rigging Manual, which are great starts.

Thanks so much!
Jack.

 

[wjejr]

Hi Jack, If you can find a copy of the Sunfish Bible, I would certainly grab it. It's an old book, and some of it's relevant and some of it's not, but I find it all interesting and have looked through it many times.

 

[Lafayette Mike]

Hi all,

With kids at 3 and 8 years old, and a love for sailing that's been dormant since a community college course in high school, and most recently taking a private lesson at Leeward Sailing Center in Long Beach, CA with a friend, we decided to nab a "ready to sail" 1973 Sunfish last weekend. Kid-approved sail color scheme, of course!

We had a blast yesterday!

So here's a couple initial questions for your collective wisdom:

1. Would you recommend buying a recreational line package from APS, or West Coast Sailing? Or best to just buy a separate halyard and daggerboard shock cord?
2. Any thoughts/recommendations on the mast hole? I thought perhaps inserting and securing a section of PVC would help, but perhaps it's unnecessary.
3. Is the Sunfish Bible worthwhile? Any other online or physical resources recommended for a beginner? I found Learn to Sail in 3 Days and the Rigging Manual, which are great starts.

Thanks so much!
Jack.

The recreational line package is pretty good.....regardless of who you get it from. You can try to string it all together ordering piece by piece, but it wn't save you a whole lot....

What is the issue with the mast hole? If there is no problem, you shouldn't need any PVC....

Mike

 

[beldar boathead]

Do you really need new lines? The APS package is good if you do.

Why is wrong with your “mast hole”? BTW the correct term is mast step.

Also, when you hoist your sail all the way up when you have the halyard where it is, the sail will be too high, making it hard to control when it gets windy. Move the halyard up the upper boom so the sail is perhaps 20 inches off the deck at the gooseneck (aka bronze thingy.)

 

[signal charlie]

Congratulations on your new boat! She looks great and it is nice to see kids around the Sunfish.

1. APS has good customer service when we have used them, I'd go for a kit, the boat deserves it.
2. Do you mean the hole in the mast? Either ignore it as it makes a good drain hole or try a piece of gorilla tape over it for a temp fix. We have filled some holes like that with JB Weld Aluminum but that hole may be just a bit on the big side.
3. Sunfish Bible is definitely worthwhile, there is a lot of fun stuff to learn about the boat. We of course would recommend our book, The Sunfish Owners Manual, published Dec 2013. And we have a children's book too, Zip the Little Wooden Sailboat.

 

[Dickhogg]

A beautiful boat! I love the sail.
Looks like your halliard is permanently attached to the upper spar with a hose-clamp. Mine was like this too when I got it. A boom hitch looks better, is a cool knot to tie and is adjustable. https://www.animatedknots.com/boom-hitch-knot
(I think other people on this forum use diferent knots here. ) You will still need some electrical tape on the spar to stop the hitch from slipping. Use white tape as black goes funny in the sun.

 

[L&VW]

Do you really need new lines? The APS package is good if you do. Why is wrong with your “mast hole”? BTW the correct term is mast step.
Also, when you hoist your sail all the way up when you have the halyard where it is, the sail will be too high, making it hard to control when it gets windy. Move the halyard up the upper boom so the sail is perhaps 20 inches off the deck at the gooseneck (aka bronze thingy.)

The photo shows a real hole in the mast. (Typical of a saltwater Sunfish ). Yes, tape it, but look into an official mast-sleeve retrofit. (Or an unofficial one).

Of the last six or seven Sunfish I've bought, all had lines that were shorter than practical.

For example, if you're raising your sail knee-deep in water (as I often do) a "short" halyard will be waving out of reach. Sometimes, when approaching your landing-spot, a gust of wind will overpower the sail. It's best not to be "at the end of your rope" at that moment. (You'll arrive going too fast). If you're ordering lines, order an extra three- to five-feet of each. After finishing the ends, you can always use the portions that are found to be "excess" somewhere else.

.

 

[Desultor]

Thanks for the warm welcome, and all the tips!


1. Replacement Lines

I definitely need a new halyard. I tried to show in the picture, but there’s parts without core and parts without sheathing. We were all praying it would hold in one piece for our maiden voyage!

The hose clamp’s placement was unexpected, and that plus my pre-voyage installation of a cleat on the mast (at 40” above the base) meant I couldn’t get the upper spar to the top of the mast – the gooseneck hit the bottom of the cleat. I’ll give the hose clamp and halyard a proper burial soon, and tape/tie halyard at a proper height.

I have actual “gaff” tape in black, but should I find some white electrical tape for this, as I’ve read elsewhere? And should the boom hitch (yeah, what a cool knot, and a great site to show how to tie!) be tied around the tape, or below (when raised) the taped section of upper spar?

Sounds like getting the kit is a convenient value…. if the lines are as long as I’d like. APS’s kit is 32’ mainsheet, and 24’ halyard, and WestCoast’s kit is 25’ each. So, it looks like I should order the lines separately. 3-5 extra feet for halyard/mainsheet would be 28-30, correct? I’m convinced that securing halyard to the cleat-on-mast is the way to go, and then to secure gooseneck to the mast cleat on deck.

While I’m ordering line, is it worth nabbing a bungee for the daggerboard? Mine has none.

Are there any other sites recommended for good quality value lines? I feel like I’ve seen a thread here that mentions a third online vendor, but I can’t find it now.


2. Mast Hole

I should’ve been more descriptive! Yes, I meant “corrosion hole in the mast,” not the mast step. If it’s safe to ignore it, I’ll gladly do so. I feel like I saw somewhere advice to drill a hole in the mast base end-cap, to rinse with fresh water. Good idea? Or better to keep the pipes as sealed as possible, to give buoyancy to discourage turtling / ease in righting?

I lean toward unofficial retrofitting, if necessary – I’m more in line with the rat rod crowd, vs. showboaters. =) Any thoughts on PVC inside vs. stainless? Pop-rivets fine for this? I thought matching aluminum to aluminum was preferred…


3. Literature

Great book recommendations! I see the Sunfish Bible is available new for $30 at APS (though it “Usually ships in 4 weeks or more” – what, do they print them on demand?) and I’m a sucker for free shipping minimums ($50 at APS).

 

[L&VW]

Thanks for the warm welcome, and all the tips!


1. Replacement Lines

I definitely need a new halyard. I tried to show in the picture, but there’s parts without core and parts without sheathing. We were all praying it would hold in one piece for our maiden voyage!

The hose clamp’s placement was unexpected, and that plus my pre-voyage installation of a cleat on the mast (at 40” above the base) meant I couldn’t get the upper spar to the top of the mast – the gooseneck hit the bottom of the cleat. I’ll give the hose clamp and halyard a proper burial soon, and tape/tie halyard at a proper height.

I have actual “gaff” tape in black, but should I find some white electrical tape for this, as I’ve read elsewhere? And should the boom hitch (yeah, what a cool knot, and a great site to show how to tie!) be tied around the tape, or below (when raised) the taped section of upper spar?

Sounds like getting the kit is a convenient value…. if the lines are as long as I’d like. APS’s kit is 32’ mainsheet, and 24’ halyard, and WestCoast’s kit is 25’ each. So, it looks like I should order the lines separately. 3-5 extra feet for halyard/mainsheet would be 28-30, correct? I’m convinced that securing halyard to the cleat-on-mast is the way to go, and then to secure gooseneck to the mast cleat on deck.

While I’m ordering line, is it worth nabbing a bungee for the daggerboard? Mine has none.

Are there any other sites recommended for good quality value lines? I feel like I’ve seen a thread here that mentions a third online vendor, but I can’t find it now.


2. Mast Hole

I should’ve been more descriptive! Yes, I meant “corrosion hole in the mast,” not the mast step. If it’s safe to ignore it, I’ll gladly do so. I feel like I saw somewhere advice to drill a hole in the mast base end-cap, to rinse with fresh water. Good idea? Or better to keep the pipes as sealed as possible, to give buoyancy to discourage turtling / ease in righting?

I lean toward unofficial retrofitting, if necessary – I’m more in line with the rat rod crowd, vs. showboaters. =) Any thoughts on PVC inside vs. stainless? Pop-rivets fine for this? I thought matching aluminum to aluminum was preferred…


3. Literature

Great book recommendations! I see the Sunfish Bible is available new for $30 at APS (though it “Usually ships in 4 weeks or more” – what, do they print them on demand?) and I’m a sucker for free shipping minimums ($50 at APS).

Halyard:
I saw your old halyard—weak sheathing is the part to worry about. Cores are quite tough.

Tape:
I like the idea of white electrical tape. Black tape doesn't just get "funny"—it gets "runny"! I've got gaffer's tape, but haven't tried it on a boat. The adhesive is desirably weak in this application—a plus!

Bungee:
You'll want a bungee, but there are alternatives for any extra line you've got.

Hitch:
The Boom Hitch looks good, but if you forget how it "goes", here's a simpler one that is also adjustable:
Geezer vs. Racing Rigs

Mast:
As you've suggested, holes in the mast and spars are to be discouraged.

Using one good mast, I went a step further by gooping-up the interior with an anti-corrosive, and pulling ⅔ of a foam swim noodle through its length.



Capsize recovery in a strong wind is difficult enough without trying to lift the added weight of internal water.

"Unofficial" Mast-Reinforcement:
PVC, if it's a tight fit, would be good. The idea is to keep the mast reinforced internally from the base upwards, about 30-inches. Hurricane Irma floated a fiberglass windsurfer mast to my yard. It's strong and tapered, so I'll have to see if it'll fit.

Aluminum is best—even if it's a bit thin. Matching metals is always a good idea, but I wouldn't refuse a stainless-steel reinforcement, if it's free scrap from Meineke Mufflers.
Need Your Opinion on Hole in Mast Options

.

 

[signal charlie]

Gaff tape would be awesome, I was going to suggest it but didn't know how many folks would be familiar. It has a nice rough surface and we use it on a lot of places on out boats, mainly where wood or metal touches wood on our wooden spars, sprit rig on the Penobscot 14 and mast thwart on the Drascombe Lugger. I just taped the tiller extension on CHIP, it is tapered and small at the wrong end, tape will help us keep a grip.

The white electrical tape is thinner and is useful to place between the gooseneck (bronze) and the boom (aluminum) to reduce dissimilar metal corrosion caused by electrical current. It is thinner than the cloth gaff tape. The bronze leaches the aluminum I believe, esp if saltwater is involved. Always best to rinse spars if the get saltwatered and let sail air dry. For your upper spar you could put a piece of gaff tape right where you life to tie your halyard and tie your hitch around the tape. It also makes a nice marker to helper remember where to tie the halyard.

I like how gaff tape has come full circle, it was used on sailing ships and sailors brought it ashore when they were hired to work the fly loft in the theatres, because they "knew the ropes". It was used on ships to protect wooden spars. The pin rails in some theaters are amazing.

This is what I feel like when I rig my 72 sf sprit rig...

I like the extra foot on the halyard because we tie lower on the upper spar than most. Some folks go even longer and run the halyard back to the cockpit into a cleat there. We always buy extra halyard size line because we cut a bow line (10 feet) and a bridle, then have some line left over for sail ties. I think you can call APS or WC and tell them how long you want it, order over the phone.

You need something to retain the daggerboard to the boat, so it doesn't float off after a capsize. Bungee is one way to do it. Another is a simple 1/8th inch retainer line.

Yankee Boating Center aka https://www.sunfishsailboats.com is a great place to order line, if you call and talk to them they will try to cut lines to match your boat colors. The chart above is compliments of YBC.

Not sure if APS has the Sunfish Bible on the shelves or not. You can ask when you call Last I knew they were not print on demand, but rather there were stacks of them somewhere. Our book TSOM prints on demand.

 

[Desultor]

Alright, I went with West Coast Sailing for the replacement lines:

• 5mm Sirius 500 Line (Color: Black) 60563 30 $0.38 USD $11.40 USD
• 8mm Orion 500 Line (Color: Blue) 60549 30 $0.64 USD $19.20 USD
• Hobie 1/4 inch Shockcord (Black) 23049 10 $0.35 USD $3.50 USD
• Harken Micro Eyestrap H281 60686 1 $1.70 USD $1.70 USD
• Subtotal: $35.80 USD
• Shipping: $0.00 USD
• Grand Total: $35.80 USD

They give free shipping with a $35 minimum, and no tax. Great customer service! The day after the order they called to confirm some choices with me that pertained to how fast they could ship it out. The color I had selected for the halyard was out of stock, and the eyestrap was due in stock that afternoon or the next day. The third day (today) it shipped out from Portland, Oregon, and USPS predicts delivery to me in SoCal on Monday.

I measured the old lines today. The original halyard was 26 feet, the main sheet only 20 feet!

I taped three locations on the upper spar with my 2" gaffer's tape:

• 54” from the head (racing)
• 64” from the head (short Jens)
• 74” from the head (Jens/recreational)
• 84” was where the original halyard was attached!

Now to practice my clove and boom hitches while I wait for the new line to arrive!

Thanks again!