Adding sail tape strip on sail...legal?

jlanc64

New Member
I need to put a strip across the sail near the top of the sail as someone has drawn a nice pink butterfly on there (with highlighter/permanent pen) and will not come out (tried everything) so I am going to get some sail tape and just stick it over the top of the spot.

So I am just wondering if it is legal to do so? (Have had a look in the laser rule book but can not find anything) - as it is not increasing anything or changing the sail I would say it would be legal.
Pic shown for what I am going to do

radialsailwithbluetapacrosstop.jpg
 
Interesting .... I'll run this past the World Measurer, but it might take a week or so.

IMO, as long as you're just covering the butterfly you should be fine, as it's no different to sticky back cloth being used for advertising purposes. There is an issue with the tape if it looks like you are reinforcing the sail panels, particularly in the head, tack and clew area.

As a side not, the class rules are written in a specific manner that "The principles of the Laser Class Rules is that no changes to the boat are allowed unless they are specifically permitted by the class rules" (from the introduction to the class rules). So your statement " (Have had a look in the laser rule book but can not find anything) - as it is not increasing anything or changing the sail I would say it would be legal." is in contempt of the introduction to the class rules.
 
Thanks for that :)
And yes the only purpose for using the sticky back sail tape is to cover the butterfly.

Cheers
 
If you find that you are not permitted to use tape, here's a couple alternatives. I have recently painted some lettering and artwork on a sail (not a Laser sail) for an event my club is participating in. I used fabric paint from the craft store, and it remains flexible. You'd have to use several coats. I don't know how durable it will be, but it could be an alternative to tape, as paint would not be reinforcement of the panel, at least not a good one. I guess this could be illegal too though. Another alternative would be to take a permanent marker and turn the butterfly into something else, as they do when concealing a tattoo.
 
Hi,
I had nearly the same problem. Only difference, in my case, it did belong "not removable" old sail numbers (painted to the sail with a permanent marker).

Related class rules:

Rule 26. a:
Repairs and preventative maintenance to the sail,
hull, deck, centreboard, rudder, mast, boom or
any fittings and fixings may be carried out without
violation of these Rules provided such repairs
are made in such a way that the essential shape,
characteristics or function of the original are not
affected

and

Rule 26.d:
Sail panels and luff sleeves shall not be replaced.

and

Rule 24. TAPE
The use of flexible adhesive tape or similar is permitted
to secure shackle pins and clips, and to bind sheets,
lines and rigging, except that tapes shall not be used
to construct new fittings or modify the function of the
existing fittings.

and the "Fundamental Rule" of the class rules:
FUNDAMENTAL RULE:
The Laser shall be raced in accordance with these
rules, with only the hull, equipment, fittings, spars,
sail and battens manufactured by a licensed builder
in accordance with the Laser design specification
(known as the Construction Manual) which is
registered with ISAF.
No addition or alteration may be made to the hull
form, construction, equipment, type of equipment,
placing of equipment, fittings, type of fittings, placing
of fittings, spars, sail and battens as supplied by the
builder except when such an alteration or change
is specifically authorised by Parts 2 or 3 of these
Rules.


The "hardliner"s-way:
Rule 26 a is injured, in reason of ..."essential shape,
CHARACTERISTICS or function of the original are affected.". One is fixing "Tape" on the sail at an area where the class rule does not "specifically authorises" it (Fundamental Rule / and: Rule 24 does not say something about using of "tape" on the sail ), although rule 26 d is not injured.

The way I would "think" to:

Basically, Rule 10 permits to add "Advertising" f.e to the sail, too.
I have another, class-legal sail (used by the former owner, a proLaserite of Team GER, and officially measured with that advertising at the "Princesa Sophia Cup", Palma de Mallorca 2001, Spain). The advertising is made out of self-adhesive Dracon-"insignia cloth" and does not change the "characteristics" of the sail.

Ergo:
Would it be permitted to use such "self-adhesive Dracon-"insignia cloth"" (in the same colour like the sail, http://www.gotthardt-technik.de/data/archive/katalogseiten_2009/Klebetuch_Streifen.pdf ) "to paste over" such old sail numbers or, in the case above: the pink butterfly?

I would wonder, if it would be not permitted to do so, in reason f.e.: If the luff tube of the sail gets ripped, in reason of a bend of the upper mast section, a common maintenance to such a damage to the sail is to repair it with "self-adhesive Dracon-"insignia cloth"" (additionally professionally by a sail maker sewed with a seam).

How ever, I am not permitted to "interpret" the class rules, sorry:

2. MEASUREMENT
In the case of a dispute alleging non-compliance with
the Construction Manual, the matter, together with
any relevant information, shall be referred to the Chief
Measurer of the International Laser Class Association
at the International Office who shall give a final ruling in
consultation with an ISAF Technical Officer


So, only the ILCA Chief Measurer (in consultation with an ISAF Technical Officer) is permitted to expound the class rules, I'm afraid.


BTW "jlanc64": You did use a Radial sail for the sketch. If you are a female Laserite (can't say it from your public profile) you probably have to add the red "Rhombus" (view class rule 4.g). If you plan to paste over the butterfly, like you have done it in your sketch, attend to not injure this "Rhombus"-rule.

Ciao
LooserLu
 
Yeh not a female ;) the red rhombus was on there and I have taken it off.
Don't have much of a choice other than to cover this, might see if I can get some white sail tape which is not see through and put it on there.

For advertising how does that work? Are you allowed to add just letters ect? pattern? with extra material.

Off to the sail maker later on this week to see what I can get to cover it up.
(most of the time I'll be using the sail in club events and maybe some local regattas so I should be fine using it)
 
...most of the time I'll be using the sail in club events and maybe some local regattas so I should be fine using it
Yes of course, I think ,so, too. Just ask the sailmaker for a suitable residual piece of white self-adhesive insignia cloth that he perhaps has somewhere at his backyard. What I told above is more for those, who have the "honour" to meet the tough ILCA measurers at big events...

For advertising how does that work? Are you allowed to add just letters ect? pattern? with extra material.
Below, in attachment, is a photo of that sail I did told about above. The advertising is pasted over to the sail with coloured Dracon self-adhesive insignia cloth.

Ciao
LooserLu
 

Attachments

  • Advertising on sail - Example.jpg
    Advertising on sail - Example.jpg
    84 KB · Views: 51
This is an interesting case so both Alan Downes and myself referred this to Jean-Luc Michon for an opinion. We have just received a reply from him. Essentially he is saying:-

1. Stripes added to the sail to help the sailor see the shape of the sail are not legal and break the fundamental rule.

2. A patch to repair or maintain the sail may be allowed as long as according to the discretion of the measurer the intent of the sailor is just that. The patch to disguise the unwanted marking may be considered such a case. A patch in white to match the sail would be preferable as it helps to build the case that the intent is for repair purposes only.

3. Under the advertising rule an advertising sticker could be put on in this location.

4. Making your sail distinctive is rarely an advantage because it can be picked easily by the race officer at the start!
 
If it was presented to me at measuring with tape across the area, as long as you've put the tape across the smallest possible area, to cover the offending "butterfly" then I wouldn't have an issue with it. If however the tape covers from the luff to the leach and a large section of a panel near the head of the sail, then I'm definitely going to wonder if the tape is there to reinforce the panel and will seriously consider not permitting it. Keep the tape to the minimium!

As for the permanent marker pen ink, have you tried using carbon tetra chloride (dry cleaning fluid) or white spirits (shellite / lighter fuel). I can understand methyl alcohol (metholated spirits) and ethanol (iso alcohol) not working, along with most other household chemical cleaning agents.

As I'm a former International Moth Sailor, why do you have an issue with butterflies on your sail ;)
 
...
As for the permanent marker pen ink, have you tried using carbon tetra chloride (dry cleaning fluid) or white spirits (shellite / lighter fuel). I can understand methyl alcohol (metholated spirits) and ethanol (iso alcohol) not working, along with most other household chemical cleaning agents.
...

AlanD, I did try that and many more "odd fluids", but no success. If the ink of a permanent marker (such as from "edding") is old ( = already long time on the sail) it is not successful possible to get the ink away 100%. One "smear"/"blur" the ink to bigger spots over the sail only and that looks much more bad.... The only "solution" that really was helpful, was: that Dracon insignia sail cloth. You know, the sail is made out of Dracon and the patch not goes full from luff to leech. The patch is only there where the old sailmubers are to find. Nevertheless, I haven't a good feeling about to use such a sail at a big event, so, I used it for regional races only. I never was at the first 1/3 in the racing fleet with that sail. So, the other competitors and the RC have been fair enough and didn't care about.

Ciao
LooserLu
 
Off to the sail maker soon to collect some self-adhesive insignia cloth, he said that if I used the white stuff it would still be able to see it. So he said I should go with either blue or black. Blue seems the way to go as it matches the radial colour.

If I were to use this piece as an advertising spot it should be allowed. (not that I plan to at this stage)

This is somewhat what I plan to do/we shall see what he says.

lasertape.jpg
 
Got a black piece and he recommended a circle :)
Therefore less material and I can stick a nice sponsor logo in it.

Thanks for your help,

Cheers
 
The circle is 31cm wide.
Looks something like this
Did not turn out too bad, might get a few strange looks at the sailing club with it but better than the pink butterfly ;)
Might have to put some sort of sponsorship logo on there

blackcircleonsail.jpg
 

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