Tipping Over and Taking In Water

Discussion in 'Capri/Catalina 14 Talk' started by EGarcia, Jul 2, 2009.

  1. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    I tipped over my 14.2 this past Sunday. Luckily I had a lot of good people help me and after it turtled we were able to up right it. When I finally got home I pulled the drain plug and got a steady stream of water for over half an hour. I do mean steady and with a fair amount of pressure. I would estimate it must have taken in over 30 gallons of water. I estimate the boat was cap sized for 15- 30 minutes. I could not find any cracks or holes where water would have entered. Has any one experienced taking in that much water?
     
  2. gregwcoats

    gregwcoats Member

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    With the boat on the trailer and the drain plug removed, take a garden hose and turn it up full blast. Spray the water all over the hatch that covers the forward compartment and watch for water to come out of the drain hole. Make sure the boat is tilted back so that any water that makes its way inside the boat will drain towards the back and out the drain hole. That is the only way you could have that much water inside the boat, I think. If you install a "Baby Bob" masthead float you should not have that problem next time you dump the boat, because the boat will be much eaiser to right, and therefor won't have time for much water to enter it. Let us know what you find out.
     
  3. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    I have a 1990 model w/o a hatch. I will get a hose and direct water at every possible entry and see what happens. Good idea to lift the front and pull the plug to observe.
     
  4. gregwcoats

    gregwcoats Member

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    Without a hatch, do you mean the bow of the boat is open!!!! Or is there a liner to keep water out of the bow of the boat, any water entering through that opening ends up in the bottom of the boat, sounds to me like you got lucky the boat did not sink. I am cureous to know more about what you have.
     
  5. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    I believe I have a Verision 2. Take a look at the pictures Tretonlane just posted in the classified adds. The hull is sealed and where I believe you have a hatch, I just have a nominal 11" x 14" x 4' storage compartment.

    FYI, I have removed all the rigging and was cleaning and waxing the boat today. I removed all the screws and was thinking of applying a little sealent when I reattached all the rigging. any thoughts?

    I did not remove the screws around the center board seal. Have you ever removed them? Is that a potential site for leakage?
     
  6. gregwcoats

    gregwcoats Member

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    Just be sure to use marine grade sealent. If you use regular automobile wax, it may turn gummy if the boat is used in salt water, again use marine grade wax/cleaner.
     
  7. SHNOOL

    SHNOOL Member

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    You have a model 2... and the cubby is supposed to be sealed.

    You have a model 2... and the cubby is supposed to be sealed. My guess is the sealant leaked.

    Congrats, this is what happens to us Mod 1 people when we turtle, the hatchway provides us with VERY little water sealant! There is a reason why they put a drain plug in her you know.

    Good news though! You could fill your Mod 2 (like us Mod 1 people) and it'll still float (although very poorly mine stayed well above water with probably 400lbs or so of water in it). It is a long story but suffice to say, I filled my entire below decks with water while on the lake one time. The boat floats fine, and does not sink (thanks to LOTS of foam floatation below the seats).

    But to fix your problem... You need to remove all the screws around your cubby hole, and pry out the insert. Then run marine sealant around the hole/hatchway and put the cubby insert back in.

    Might I suggest you look at the fiberglass underside of the mast step while you are there? check for softness, cracks under the glass, and general fiberglass decay. A 1990 isn't really old (mine is a 1986), but a lot can happen in 19 years!
     
  8. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    I appreciate your comment removing and sealing the cubby and Thanks to Gregwcoats for suggesting to use marine grade sealer as I thought silicon was all the same.
     
  9. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    Now for the story as I am trying to figure out what went wrong. Everyone talks about high winds. My experience was in very mild winds. In fact I was spending most of my time looking for a puff of wind. I am new to sailing and I took a work intern for his first experience. I did coach him on evastive actions if the boat tipped. We were sailing and the little wind we had was from the starboard. I had the main sheet uncleated and I had just advised the crewman to unlceat the jib and move to the starboard side. At that time the boat started to dip toward the port side. I tried to shift farther but the boat appeared to continue its dipping and I also recall the boat dipped toward the bow. I could tell we were not going to recover, so I told the crewman to be prepared to go over. I thnk it happened in slow motion. I swam to the centerboard and the crewman stayed by the mast. I was not able to climb on to the center board, but was able to pull on it enough to start uprighting it when the center board slipped. The boat rolled and continued until it turtled. A bypasser came to the rescue and the three of us were able to up right the boat.
    Unfortunately, I had not secured the rudder and tiller. I did have a nice rope/wood step ladder attached to the stern which made it easy to climb back in. The by passer was kind enough to pull me back to the dock. I weigh 180 and the intern weigh about 160. Thus I had a 20 lb advantage, but the jib was cleated. I can not believe that was enough to tip the boat in such mild winds. Any thoughts.
    FYI, today I did purchase the Baby Bob to add to the mst until I get more proficient at sailing
     
  10. SHNOOL

    SHNOOL Member

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    Ok I am confused... but lemme get this straight.. your tacking procedure had both of you on the port side while headed into the wind that was starboard?

    So your 160 and 180 lbs were both neutral or low side (same side as the sails), during the tack?

    Um this is too easy... the hull weighs 330lbs... it didn't take much wind to exceed weight needed to keep you going over! Yeah, it'd happen pretty quick in that scenario. Best bet as you feel the boat doing that... is to THROW yourself on the high side as you go over (the crewman switching sides was probably in a better angle to do that)...

    As for the centerboard? The bungee cord (if the right one), should have kept the centerboard DOWN while the boat went on its side... However I don't know if it is strong enough in a turtling situation (it should be0.
     
  11. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    Not quite right. I was on the starboard side countering the main sail, the jib and crewman.

    I let the mainsheet out, so the main sail should not have been a factor as it was luffing, the crewman and I were on opposite sides, he was port side and I was starboard. So my weight should have had a 20 lb advantage to the starboard side. I was in the process of uncleateing the jib. So it would appear the jib caught enough of the wind to counter my 20 lb advantage and tip the boat. No doubt if the crewman had been on the starboard side with me, the puff would not have tipped the boat.

    What confuses me is I have sailed in stronger winds. My other crewman were more aggressinve in countering the wind and keeping the boat balanced. So it apears I have to make sure who ever sails with me stays neutral or is more agressive in counter the forces.
     
  12. gregwcoats

    gregwcoats Member

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    My 1987 boat has a spring type of lock that must be depressed to remove the rudder, making it impossible to have the rudder come off in at turtle (I hope) or when beaching. I have sailed my 14.2 for just over a year and learned quickly to always have my crew, never more than one, either stay centered in the boat or up on the high side. Or just to sail solo.
     
  13. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    I can kick my self because I forgot to lock the rudder in.

    The lakes are low and I have to launch with the power boats, so I was trying out an electric trolling motor thus I got out a ways and hurried the process, thus forgetting to lock in the rudder.

    The times I have sailed, I have always had the crewman in the correct position.

    With very little wind the crewman got in the wrong position. I am still disturbed at how much water we took in. Can water enter through the seal of the centerboard?
     
  14. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    Remove the Cuddy

    It was 103F when I opened the cuddy last week and it was like a sauna. I did notice the top part of the cuddy was not sealed. I hope this is where the majority of the water came in. Letting it dry out good and then plan to inspect closer.

    As a suggestion to others, use a wide blade as you try to pry the cuddy loose. There is nothing to get a hold of to pry the cuddy open. Even with a wide blade, I still caused a couple of small chips.
     
  15. rmark

    rmark New Member

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    I noticed on a Vago forum that someone had installed an eye on their mast and was using a plaastic dock fender as a mast float - although recently I saw a Coronado 15 with a antifreeze jug tied to the nmast top as a float. West Marine sells a light weight inflatable fender that might make a good alternative to the Baby Bob or similar.
     
  16. EGarcia

    EGarcia New Member

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    If you have already decided to add a mast float, in my opinion there are at least three considerations: 1) The float must be functional (You can purchase a known product, or experiment with other type of floats, 2) The float should have minimum wind resistance (the Hobie BabyBob meets this requirement) 3) Astetics.

    You only need to meet number 1.

    Ed
     
  17. rmark

    rmark New Member

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    Thats a question I've asked myself - why mess around when I can just install the baby bob.

    I'm interested in mast floats as 1. a new sailor (starting late at age 48), 2. sailing where ' the winds come sweeping cross the plains', 3. with wife/crew/passenger who has limited mobility, 4. with a Mod.1 in nice condition - though my replacement hatch door fits about as badly as the orignal did :)
     
  18. clo126

    clo126 New Member

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    Taking on water

    I have Mod I and I've had it go turtle twice. The first time it turtled it did take on a lot water and would hardly sail once we had it right side up. I too opened it up and was surprised on the amount of water my boat had.

    Then I found out that Mod 1's are supposed to have plastic containers under the seats to add buoyancy and take up space in lieu of water. A couple of my container are gone and I emailed Catalina regarding this. They said to place plastic milk container or any plastic container under the seats. I placed about 30 plastic soda containers (thanks ed) to help with the buoyancy issue and to take up dead space.

    I'm still considering a baby bob, but one c14 fleet captain told me that you can't use one when racing.

    clo
     

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