Rules question - sailing by the lee (port or starboard).

A

astevenson

New Member
Just freshening up on the sailing rules and have a question: my reading is that port and starboard are determined by the side of the boat that the wind is coming over, not the side that the boom is on. Is this right?

Does this mean that if you are on a broad reach on port tack and bear away so that you are now sailing by the lee, you have also switched to starboard tack - even though you have NOT actually gybed?

The follow up question is how that would relate to luffing games on a leg which is square run - the windward boat on port tack bears away to sail by the lee (no gybe, but is then sailing on starboard) and has right of way over downwind port boat. Am I wrong? I am confused.

:confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused:
 
No. It's determined by the side of the boat the boom is on. So, if you're by the lee on starboard you are on starboard jibe.
 
Regardless of the by the lee question. The other boat is both upwind and overtaking therefore does not have right of way.
 
Once an overlap is establshed, (even from a clear astern position) the leeward boat does assume rights. The Weather boat must keep clear. The weather boat can not sail below their proper course to attempt to block or divert a pass from a leeward approaching boat once the leeward boat is within 2 boat lengths of the weather boat. In an "overtaking" situation port is still port and starboard still trumps port. So if you are on port jibe and see a starboard jibe boat coming, (even if it is by the lee, which it most likely will be) you better change course and get out of starboards way. Unless you are the inside overlapped boat at the leeward mark and inside the 2 length zone then starboard has to allow you room to round..
 
When a boat is sailing by-the-lee their tack is determined by the side of the boat the boom is on so that a boat with its boom out on the starboard side is on PORT tack (really, it's not that different from not sailing by-the-lee if you forget about where the wind is coming from. . .).

If two boats are sailing by-the-lee on opposite tacks then it is a straight Port-Starboard question and the Port Tack boat must keep clear. I think the only exception is when approaching the mark and the Port Tack boat is also the inside boat. I don't think Overlap & Clear Ahead/Astern can apply to boats on opposite tacks until Rule 18 applies.

Remember that when sailing by-the-lee, windward & leeward can be a bit confusing too. Leeward is defined as the side your boom is on (as far as the rules go). When two boats are sailing by-the-lee on the same tack, the "windward" boat according to the rules is actually "downwind" of the "leeward" boat. An easy way to tell which is which is your boom will point to the leeward boat.

As to "luffing games" if the boats are within 2 boat lengths, the windward boat is prevented from sailing even more by-the-lee below her proper course by Rule 17.2 (and the practical limits to how far she can go without gybing. . .). The other boat is limited in luffing to windward by Rule 17.1 if they established the overlap from clear astern.

But it never hurts to read and re-read the rules and the Cases that apply the rules to help understand them. The key parts to know are the Definitions and Parts 1-7 (with Parts 1-4 probably being the most important. . .). Getting some little boat models like the ones that come with the Elvstrom Rules book can also help visualize how things should work.

Sailing Rules 2005-2008
 
One aspect I find interesting is that the boat with rights can sail her "proper course". As I understand it this is the course she would sail in the absence of the "give way" boat(s). It does not mean she cannot head above or below the next mark. Thus (as I understand it) she can still respond to gusts and lulls heading above and below the "direct course". I would imaging it could the get interesting distinguishing between defending a position and sailing a "proper course".


Ian
 
Deimos said:
One aspect I find interesting is that the boat with rights can sail her "proper course". As I understand it this is the course she would sail in the absence of the "give way" boat(s). It does not mean she cannot head above or below the next mark. Thus (as I understand it) she can still respond to gusts and lulls heading above and below the "direct course". I would imaging it could the get interesting distinguishing between defending a position and sailing a "proper course".


Ian
Click to expand...
Yup, have seen this in action. Interestingly enough, what sounds like responding to puffs and lulls on shore, looks decidedly more agreesive on the water.
 
Double yup. Proper course might not be the straight course to the mark in given condtions and the fact that lasers sail much faster by the lee than DDW. This makes "proper course" difficult to get a handle on.
 
I appreciate everyone's comments. Can someone direct me to where it says that port/starboard is governed by what side the boom is on?

In the definitions, it says:

"Tack, Starboard or Port A boat is on the tack, starboard or port, corresponding to her windward side."

Doesn't say anything about the boom.

In Paul Elvstrom's definitions, it says that gybing is taking the mainsail from one side to the other, but I can't find that statement in the rules either.

Thanks.
 
The only rule book that matters is the RRS "Racing Rules of Sailing". You get one copy when you join US Saling and I think you can buy it off their web site.
 
Thanks, that is the rules I was reading.

I found the definition of sailing by the lee hidden away in the "Leeward/Windward" definition:

Leeward and Windward A boat’s leeward side is the side that is or, when she
is head to wind, was away from the wind. However, when sailing by the lee
or directly downwind, her leeward side is the side on which her mainsail lies.
The other side is her windward side. When two boats on the same tack overlap, the one on the leeward side of the other is the leeward boat. The other is the windward boat.

So that means that the boat does not change tack until the boat actually gybes.
 
P's only (?) defense for an aggressive by the lee S is to roll onto S. Then the P/now S is leeward boat, even though you are literally on his windward hip, and probably near to being on his wind too. Just don't gybe too close, etc.

Al
 
Curiously, I was recently wondering how this situation should be solved

bythelee.gif


Looking at the thread messages, as both boats are on starboard tack, whereas boat A's boom is pointing to boat B.

If I understood it correctly, we should consider that B is the "leeward boat". So A should keep clear, shouldn't it?

Pedro.
 
The windward/leeward definitions are pretty clear. Even though Boat A is sailing by the lee, the side of the boat that the main is on determines that Boat A is on starboard and also that the mainsail side of the boat is its leeward side. This also means that Boat B is leeward of Boat A, just as Boat A is windward of Boat B.

Rule 11 then says that the leeward boat (Boat B) has rights over Boat A (ignoring overlap considerations and making sure that Boat A has time to respond). Boat A keeps clear.
 
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