Rotten Wood

Discussion in 'Capri/Catalina 14 Talk' started by o2bsailin, Jun 18, 2007.

  1. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well I brought home my newly purchased 1992 Capri 14.2K yesterday. After beginning the cleaning and the thorough inspection I discovered water down around the keel bolts that was a brownish color. After spending 30 minutes sponging this water out to only have more re-appear, I decided to pull out the cuddy that fits under the deck. To my surprise, I found wood that was so rotten that I could poke my finger through it. Has anyone had any dealings with replacing this? I attached some pictures you can see the rotten wood and the water lines from the water sitting in the bow.
     

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  2. fan

    fan Member

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    Contact Catalina with your story and see if they have any information or advice. If you haven'talready done it, dry the boat with a dehumidifier to pull all the moisture out below decks. A little mold killer might be good to but be carefull with fumes. Good luck. I wish I could offer more help.
     
  3. cfoy

    cfoy New Member

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    Well, looks like besides the fiberglass work, you are going to have to completely replace the two vertical and horizontal pieces of wood supporting the mast. Fortunately, there is an excellent thread on how to do this. It was very helpful when I had the same job to do.

    Hope it helps. http://www.capri14.org/forum/showthread.php?t=415
     
  4. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well I sprayed the boat down with a mold/mildew killer. I then put the fan at the opening of the cuddy. I can feel air coming out of the transom plug hole, so I know it's getting good circulation. As soon as it's dried out I'll crawl down there and evaluate the complete damage. I'm planning on getting some marine grade plywood and then soaking it in west system epoxy. I don't think I'll have this problem again. Also has anyone noticed 5-6" holes in the fiberglass bulkead seperating the underneath of the seats? There's a hole on either side, and I'm not sure if this was done from catalina since this is a keel version, or if one of the previous owners did it. After peering through these holes I saw float bags underneath the seats. I think if the boat filled with water the 200lb keel will take it straight to the bottom. I don't think these float bags would help much.
     
  5. fan

    fan Member

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    Sounds like you're doing all the right things and this is on the run. Regarding the float bags , there are quit a few under the seats and I'm betting they would keep the boat a wash if it took on a pile of water. The builder could tell you the how much bouyency they provide. I'd consider closing those holes in the bulkheads with screw in inspection ports so you can retain easy access for the future. I hope your able to sail soon!
    Bob
     
  6. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well, I'm really starting to question the "bargin" I got on this boat. It turns out what I thought was a "bulkhead" is nothing more than a thin piece of fiberglass attached to the underside of the seats and the side of the deck. It serves no purpose other than to keep those float bags from coming forward. After pulling out a few float bags, to my surprise, I find more rotten wood. It appears as there are some stringers and cockpit floor supports that have all become saturated with water and failed. I took some pictures. I don't don't know how many of you have seen the underside of your cockpit...but here there are. I was thinking because I doubt there is any way to properly reattach the framework underneath the boat, does anyone think an expanding foam might work? I know it would trap water between the foam and fiberglass. Does anyone else have any suggestions? By the way, does anyone know of any want to unattach the deck from the hull? It might make my job a little easier.
     

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  7. fan

    fan Member

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    Wow, that is painful for me to look at. Are you able to work in that area? I could never get much more than my upper body in the fore peak to look aft to the float bags. If you could worm back there, you could replace the wood using liquid nails(Wear a resperator!) or maybe gorrilla glue as it cures better in dampness. Of couse , resin an fiberglass would work. I guess the important quess is the deck and hull stiffness. If that is intact, then may be its not a worry. It will all work out either way. Sorry.
     
  8. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well even worse news,I didn't realize this but bottom of the cockpit floor is wooden which is also rotten. I don't know any way to get a giant piece of plywood down there other than to repair it in pieces. When people start having problems like this do they usually scrap their boat? I haven't seen anyone on thiis forum even address this problem, even though I can't see how it wouldn't be a fairly common one. The wood doesn't appear to have any kind of sealent or epoxy coating. Has anyone ever seperated the hull and deck? This would make my repairs a lot better.
     
  9. fan

    fan Member

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    Have you sailed the boat yet? It may not be so bad. If the deck is still stiff when you stand in the boat and the hull is still pretty stiff then you could still enjoy the boat. I'm guessing there are a number of older C14.2 out there being sailed with the same issues but non of us know we are (ignorance is bliss).

    As a loyal Capri 14.2 owner, you might contact Catalina for their professional thoughts on your boat.
     
  10. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well, the gentleman before me used is and he said it sailed fine. I can see the flexing in the cockpit floor when I stand on it. My concern is if someone heavier than me, (I'm only 140) would bust through it, or at least over-flex the fiberglass. When I'm crawling inside the boat when I move, and the boat shakes on the trailer you can see noticeably that the deck is shaking independent of the hull. This causes me to believe that that structure underneath the hull is really needed in order to affix the whole "top shell" to the bottom hull. I've also noticed where the hull has began to depress due to the bunks. One of those "support" beams runs about 4 inches from where bunk supports the hull. I KNOW that not having that support there anymore it causing it to flex. Now comes the problem of getting the weight off and getting the hull back to it's natural shape in order to put that beam in, so I'm not permanently fiberglassing that depression into the hull. Any ideas? Remember this is a Keel version so we're talking 500 lbs here. And it has to be sturdy enough for me to still crawl around in inside.
     
  11. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well I've gotten about half of the rotten plywood out. When pulling off the rotten stuff I found two metal bars about 8 inches and about 3/8 of an inch thick fiberglasses to the bottom of my deck. Needless to say the fiberglass around them easily detached from the surrounding wood. I assume they are for some sort of support. Although you would think they would make it a little longer than 8 inches. They're right behind the keel support "box." Anyone have any ideas? After I get all the wood out I'll take some more pictures.
     
  12. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well the last couple days I've been working on a frame system to raise the boat off the bunks so the fiberglass won't be deformed when I add the new stringers. The outermost stringer supports the bunk and the hull a considerable amount. When that is gone, the weight of the keel wants to deform the hull. Anyhow for anyone with similar problems, or following along in this post I took some pictures of the framing. I picked up the 2x4 and 2x6 from the dumpster of a nearby construction site. Pulling out some nails made these as good as new. The strap, which I plan to cut in half was 12.99 from Northern Tool. It's two inches wide. I thought a 4" would do a better job at spreading the load, but it was over double the cost. So far I have the back completely suspended off the bunks and trailer. The front should follow tomorrow.
     

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  13. drm901

    drm901 New Member

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    pieces will work

    I haven't had to do this type of work on my Capri, but I have seen similar repairs on my other boat, a 1966 Pearson Ariel. Using pieces of plywood and glassing them in will work fine. You might contact West Systems. Their technicians will help you design a solution that will work well. I've always been so impressed with their knowledge and helpfulness.
     
  14. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Well, I know a good bit about West Systems. I've worked with it and researched it for personal use and also so I may be knowledgeable when referring this product to customers. I have read most of the "west system" manuals that we sell in the store. I had planned on using this on the repair.
     
  15. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Finally got everything cleaned out. Thought I would post a few pictures so you can get a good idea what's going on.
     

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  16. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    Alright. Well the past couple weeks I've been putting in the floor and replacing the stringers. Replacing the underside of the floor was the easiest part believe it or not. The center stringer which you see in the pictures runs down the middle of the cockpit floor. In order to get that thing fit in there, I must have crawled in and out of the "hole" 20 times. I filleted the joints, and fiberglassed over top of the fillets. Not the prettiest job, but it's my first time working with something like this. The floor is ROCK SOLID. I can jump and it doesn't flex the least bit. I still have two more stringers to replace, one of which goes about where the camera was to take the picture. I wanted to get a couple pics of the "inside" before I sealed it up with the outside stringer. I coated all of the wood with west system before installing it. That is what give the wood the "shiny" appearance. The second picture is the joint of a member going perpendicularly also called a "floor" to the stringers.
     

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  17. Roger Lohrey

    Roger Lohrey New Member

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    All that I can say is WOW! A lesser man, like me, would have scrapped the boat or sold it off. You sure have put a lot of time into this boat and it looks like you are doing a great job. I hope you will get it done this summer so you can enjoy some sailing before winter. I bet you will make sure it is dry inside before storing it for the winter.:p

    Roger
     
  18. o2bsailin

    o2bsailin New Member

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    I meant to mention this in a post at the beginning, but I keep forgetting. Before I started this whole project I contacted Catalina about the problem. I talked to the customer service representative Ken or Kent or something like that. Anyhow after numerous unanswered messages, I finally got a hold of the guy. He assured me he would do everything he could do in order to get the dimensions for all the stringers and other pieces I would be replacing. I figured it would take a lot of the headache of trying to fit a stringer to compound curve. After giving him my home address, e-mail address, phone number and fax number at different points, he never got back to me to tell me anything. So I decided to "check up" and every time it was the same thing. "I'm still trying to get my hands on the templates." After about a month and a half of this I gave up. Anyhow I finally finished everything I needed to do. I have to re-install the mast step bracket, and and cubby cave. I took some pictures with my cell phone as I couldn't get my hands on the digital camera this time. The fiberglass job was very "amateur" it should work, but thank goodness no one has to look at it. The floor is rock solid. After I put the boat back on the trailer, the major flexing around where the boat sits on the trailer bunks was eliminated. Overall I can say this job outcome was very satisfactory. The floor is stronger than it ever was. Every piece of wood going in there was coated with west system epoxy on top of already being marine grade plywood. I expect the fiberglass to rot before this wood does. Haha. I must say that this "reconstruction" has definitely been very interesting. If anyone else is having a similar problem, I hope this thread will give you a small insight to what has to be done. Also you can contact me and I'll be glad to give you a much more specific details.
     

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