Progress on new sail design ? Laser Tech committee

Discussion in 'Laser Class Politics' started by 49208, Feb 24, 2010.

  1. 49208

    49208 Tentmaker

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    It seems like it's been 6 months or so since we last brought up the subject of improving the full rig sail - Any progress reports ? What's currently being tested/developed and what is the timetable to get to the point where we, the class members, would have a longer lasting sail in our hands ?
     
  2. 49208

    49208 Tentmaker

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    No offense to anyone, but I put this thread up for the purpose of trying to get some info/answers from class officals/officers who read and post here as to the current status of sails that are being tested and what the class and builders have planned.

    I'd kindly ask that you start another thread if you wish to discuss sail issues un-related to my original question.
     
  3. Merrily

    Merrily Administrator Staff Member

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    I've moved the other posts to "Laser sail quality and cost."
     
  4. Wavedancer

    Wavedancer Upside down? Staff Member

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    The silence is deafening...

    Does this mean that an important (?) announcement is in the works?
     
  5. Eric_R

    Eric_R D10 Secretary

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    You could always sent one of the exec committee members an email. They might not visit the site as often as you think.
     
  6. 49208

    49208 Tentmaker

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    Well Tracy hasn't been to the site for a few weeks, but Clive's last vist was today, both of them are on the Tech committee.

    From what I understand, and this is second hand info, is that things are getting interesting. The builder in Australia has bought the right from Bruce Kirby, so no longer is PSE the big gorilla in the room.

    I have also heard that Pryde Sails was asked to build a test sail or two for the bulder down under. So, we have both Hyde and Pryde with sails out there being evaluated.

    But like anything, just because you have now read it on the internet, doesn't mean diddly.
     
  7. 663

    663 Member

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    Thanks for the info!

    Is there a time frame prior to the Olympics, that class equipment can't be changed. I remember something about the carbon radial spar and this and was wondering if the same "no change" period would exist for sails?
     
  8. torrid

    torrid Just sailing

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    Don't know if there is anything official, but the class seems to like to roll out rule changes to coincide with the four-year Olympic cycle (especially with big changes like a new sail design). That being said, we are well into the 2012 cycle, and the membership of course would have to vote on it. I would not expect any new sail design to become official until after the 2012 Olympics.

    But I could be wrong.
     
  9. AlanD

    AlanD Former ISAF Laser Measurer

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    Class rule changes occur annually. They are usually released during the Northern Hemisphere winter season and hopefully occur at a convenient time for us in the Southern Hemisphere since we're in the middle of our summer season. Major equipmment changes can occur at any stage, but again it's usually done in the middle of the Northern Hemisphere Winter.

    As for the carbon top section, the idea is still around, but they've had issues developing a collar. But I understand Clive has come up with an innovative idea. Personally I'd rather not see the carbon section come in, it was only for the radials but I can see people wanting to use it for the standards and this will mean that ideal weight range for the standard will be further reduced, disadvantaging us heavier people further.
     
  10. 49208

    49208 Tentmaker

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    TTT

    Clive - any comments on the sail development ?
     
  11. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    Non sense. The entire collar system is an anacronistic design for which I submitted a simple solution last century.

    All the laser needs is a shelf riveted a foot from the top of the stub mast. The gap between the outer wall of the top section and the inner wall of the lower section could be simply filled with a plastic sleeve that extends a few inches above the joint...and which would help with the trasmission of forces to the top section...lessening the point loading.
    Top sections could be easily end for ended and rotated to any angle and would probably last forever....lowering parts sales for our monopoly builders...

    As for a carbon top section...it can be designed to fit in the shelved lower tube with no collars.

    The problem with the expensive carbon top section remains it is a really stupid way to build inexpensive playtoys that attract large numbers of players..

    Aluminum extrusion outperforms plastics in durability tests and costs a fraction of the price to manufacture.

    Add shelves in the lowers and end the top section breakage problems forever.

    Carbon for radial ltops to protect the lowers?? Carbon is a mighty expensive say to solve the problem. The modification of the radial sail design seems to be solving the problem....and if the current redesign doesn't solve the problem...the monopoly builders can try again.
     
  12. TonyB

    TonyB Member

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    Bump.

    Surely someone has some information on the new sails? It's over two years since I saw the test sails at the Terrigal Worlds, and not a lot has been said since. Does the lack of news mean that a major announcement is in the works, or is it just that progress has stalled?

    I've also heard stories about big changes happening at the builder level, with the Australian manufacturer apparently taking a much more significant role at a global level.

    It's a shame that for such a big class, information about what is going on can be so hard to come by. Reports from ILCA meetings, or better yet minutes, should be published online, similar to how NALA does it.
     
  13. torrid

    torrid Just sailing

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    I recently heard (don't remember where) that the Australian builder bought the rights to the design from Bruce Kirby.
     
  14. AlanD

    AlanD Former ISAF Laser Measurer

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    Something like that, from my understanding.
     
  15. 49208

    49208 Tentmaker

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    It almost seems as if someone has made the decision to NOT keep us informed - Clive from the ILCA tech committee was on the forum yesterday, and I know I've sent him a PM or two pointing him to this thread, asking for an update....

    And I sure don't see anything over on the ILCA site keeping us appraised...

    Membership sure has it's privleges :(
     
  16. LooserLu

    LooserLu LooserLu

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    View it from the professional site (I have to do this all the time in my job). There are informations, one not even is permitted to tell them to the own wife...

    Clive is Technical Officer at ILCA, the best we ever had for many times, in my opinion,... but in the moment he is in an official position he as to be loyal to...

    I have send my own PM's to another technical issue and my suitable solution to it to CLive and (Tacy via postal service). I got friendly interims messages of Clive (but not of Tracy), often with a big delay but not more til now. However, he (and I guess Tracy, too) is doing what he is able to, but sometimes we have to wait and practice intensive to be calm poise.

    Happy sailing

    LooserLu
     
  17. 49208

    49208 Tentmaker

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    I think we can all certainly appreciate the fact that info may not be able to be shared with the general public, but if that's the case , at least tell us that the class/and or individual representitives can not respond to the request (and it's a little hard to believe it is, since this is a class with dues paying members as opposed to a business with trade secrets to keep away from the public/competitors)
     
  18. AlanD

    AlanD Former ISAF Laser Measurer

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    I suspect they are often unable to divulge information because of requirements of their position or simply that they don't know. In addition, I suspect many matters are only decided upon at World Council meetings, which occur at the Standard rig worlds. Having said that, there is also a possibility that discussing such matters may result in people holding off buying new equipment / boats resulting in a lot of obsolete stock when the new equipment becomes available.

    btw As a measurer, we generally only find out things at the same time as the ordinary members and with things like the new centreboard brakes, I haven't yet seen one as they aren't buying distributed by the Australian manufacturer.
     
  19. Der_Dude

    Der_Dude Member

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    Sounds like: I could tell you but then I'd have to kill you. ;-)

    It's probably all about business, about getting the timing right for putting the new sail on the market, like Alan said. That's all.
     
  20. powergroove

    powergroove Member

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    A simple, someone is working on it, but I cant go into any details would be enough to at least tell us they are listening to us......
     

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