New standard sail

Discussion in 'Laser Class Politics' started by TonyB, Aug 14, 2010.

  1. TonyB

    TonyB Member

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    It's not a problem for my fleet. Everyone uses legal sails, and seems pretty happy to do so. I think the general attitude in the fleet is that a new sail would be nice, but in the meantime the old sail isn't as bad as its reputation implies.

    Without wanting to generalise too much, I suspect that replica sails are a greater problem in fleets with a higher proportion of non-class members.
     
  2. Deimos

    Deimos Member

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    I think it is about a balance between cost and longevity. If the class legal sail cost 3 times as much as a replica yet was fully competitive for 30 times as long then class legal would be the cheapest way to go (daft numbers to illustrate the point).

    The issue with the current sail is not so much the cost but the cost in relation to how quickly it becomes uncompetitive.

    Ian
     
  3. Deimos

    Deimos Member

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    Over the last few years I have been a member of 4 different sailing clubs (I have been moving around a bit) and all have significant numbers of knock-off sails. One club (I am no longer a member of), 1st time I turned-up and rigged I was immediately told I should stop using the class legal sail, save it for important events and buy a replica sail. More recent clubs have around/over 50% knock-off sails (including class captains). It may easily be that non-class members are more likely to sail with knock-off gear - certainly at one club I have sailed at class membership is exceptionally low.

    Once a new sail is available, I wonder if the Class Associations could start acting to revert the "anything goes" rules many fleets seem to have adopted. Maybe say to clubs that "next year if you want to be a Laser fleet you can only sail Lasers and clubs with "anything goes" will not have open events listed, not have any support from class association, etc." (with allowances for those who already have knock-offs).

    Ian
     
  4. powergroove

    powergroove Member

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    I think you will run the risk of losing fleets who have lost trust in the Class, plus, what support do local fleets have from the Class or Builder? Im helping with a "Laser Only, One design, no knock-off sails regatta" at my club this weekend and havent seen any support.
    Who should we ask for, and what kind of support should we expect?
     
  5. Deimos

    Deimos Member

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    I have no idea. I was sort of hoping that somebody could do something to restore the class to being a one design - and that I doubt the builder would so only really leaves the Class Association. Of course that would only be after the new sail was available.

    If they can do nothing is would seem that once a club starts "anything goes" that that is it for good = end of Laser class.

    Ian
     
  6. 49208

    49208 Tentmaker

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    We contact our local dealer(s) and lean on them for support, in return for promoting them in the NOR, skippers meeting etc.. We also invite them onsite with their "regatta" van and then can do on site sales...
     
  7. Eric_R

    Eric_R D10 Secretary

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    You don't do that anyway for events? Most regattas in the are usually have a local dealer come for support. I think that might be a reason you don't see many knock offs in my area, the dealers are close and always around.
     
  8. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    The Austin fleet has only one sailor with an Intensity rag and he usually doesn't make it past the leeward mark by teh time the rest of the fleet has finished... and, unfortunatly, gets pissed if anyone attempts to help him..
     
  9. Rob B

    Rob B Active Member

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    Sounds like a peach of guy. I would think with that attitude he won't be around long in the Laser. I'm hope you're not associating using a knock off sail w/being an a-hole....
     
  10. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    I'm still taking the hopeful high road.

    believing...

    He believes singlehended boats and self sufficiency go together and he sees help as derision from those who can toward those who are not able to figure it out on their own...

    Which could piss me off as it assumes some mighty insulting things about the rest of us but the beginner in any group is a fragile addition to the mix whose personality and social needs must be figured out by the group before the beginner's interaction with the group proves intolerable.

    For some that takes about one second. Sometimes it never happens.

    As long as I see no malice I try to avoid assigning blame or calling names...

    even when the newbie is someone with whom my first 100 interactions totally suck.
     
  11. drLaser

    drLaser Member

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    Greetings!

    It surely has been a long time. :)

    I definitely support this project. We did ask ILCA to push for a new Standard sail design. Not at all costs, though! For instance, would you like this 12-panel, bi-radial cut sail to render all current sails obsolete overnight, or to cost 970 USD, or to be required (or not required) for sanctioned events racing?

    Why doesn't anybody even mention ILCA membership approval of the final design and introduction procedures? Or has your experience with the new Australian-built and "GRP infusion" foils conditioned all of you to sheepishly accept whatever the Builder pushes down your throats as "Builder Supplied"?

    Love you all! Especially you, Fred!
     
  12. torrid

    torrid Just sailing

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    I see this issue has become hot enough to draw you back from hibernation!
     
  13. powergroove

    powergroove Member

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    How about a $500 sail that shapes nicely and lasts.
    Thats not too much to ask is it?
     
  14. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    For those who don't know what this means. Visit the internet Wayback Machine

    for thiose who don't know what the Wayback Machine is>>>


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBj14W5vY04&feature=related"]YouTube - Rocky and Bullwinkle - Minisode 05[/ame]
     
  15. Merrily

    Merrily Administrator Staff Member

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    Thanks for the R & B clip, Fred, but it didn't include any mention of the Wayback Machine! Loved the dragon bit with Professor Peabody and his boy Sherman, but it still didn't include the Wayback Machine!
     
  16. Rob B

    Rob B Active Member

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    OMG. Dr. Laser LIVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  17. Wavedancer

    Wavedancer Upside down? Staff Member

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    I want proof!

    :)
     
  18. Dr._Loser

    Dr._Loser From 3# World

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    .
    Hi everybody !!!!!!:):):):):):):):):)
    (I will not fight anymore, i swear Merrily !!!!)

    I send you a picture from my vacation !!!!!

    It's me, horse riding ( with a life jacket !!!:p:p:p:p:p:p:p )

    What are you talking about ???

    A super big hug from the ass of the world !!

    Alex
     

    Attached Files:

  19. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    OK Here's a modern Wayback Machine story. It isn't really from the Rocky and Bullwinkle show but it is similar enough...>>>


     
  20. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    OK... This one is a lot more appropriate to Lasers, bringing in different sails, and this thread>>>

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuWhgyGWkgE&feature=fvw"]YouTube - The Bullwinkle Show "Mr. Know-It All"[/ame]
     

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