New Foils

Discussion in 'Laser Talk' started by Matt, Jun 21, 2010.

  1. Matt

    Matt New Member

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  2. Horizon

    Horizon Member

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    The Infused Foils website shows the new foils, but I don't think they are available in the UK yet - certainly not on the Laser Performance online store.

    www.infusedfoils.com/infusedfoils/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_5&zenid=dfqoc1efg5kc7saq16a7f32ec6

    It seems they provided the foils for the Sunfish Worlds that have just finished in Italy, but the daggerboards were too thick and had to be ground down before they could fit in the slots!

    www.sunfishforum.com/showthread.php?t=33275

    http://picasaweb.google.nl/bankersenpiet/Zwaard#

    I wonder if they will supply the foils for the upcoming Laser Worlds in the UK?
     
  3. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    Is this the announcement of the total abandonment of the Compton produced foils that served our one design class for the most recent 120,000 hulls??

    Will we all be forced to retrofit our boats to be competitive or will the new blades be slower and cause us to horde the old ones??

    It hAS to be one or the other...

    no way they can possibly be EXACTLY the same.
     
  4. torrid

    torrid Just sailing

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    I wouldn't be too worried about it. From the sound of it, anyone who buys a new boat with the fancy blades will have to buy an old set on eBay just to have some that fit.
     
  5. Deimos

    Deimos Member

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    I notice there are two types: Standard and Elite. However I cannot see anything that say the difference. Anybody know what the different types are (maybe one "training" and one "class legal" ?).

    Ian
     
  6. PiersHS

    PiersHS Member

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    Standard might be the normal foam boards with elite being the infused GRP-foils?
     
  7. nedsbeds

    nedsbeds New Member

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    No they can't be exactly the same, but maybe differ in areas other than performance. Perhaps durability, strength or cost.
     
  8. Sean

    Sean Member

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    They will no doubt differ in the quality of the finish and possibly stiffness compared to the old foam boards.

    Standard and Elite kinda says it all doesn't it.

    I would guess if your serious about your racing the higher quality (higher cost) foils will be the first choice.

    The manufacturers are looking to squeeze a little more money out of people when they make a sale.

    Even without seeing them I would be quite confident that it will be a must have purchase.
     
  9. Eric_R

    Eric_R D10 Secretary

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    If Crompton won't make them anymore you don't have a choice.
     
  10. torrid

    torrid Just sailing

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    I could see changing the blades for a practical reason - cost, durability, no builder, etc. It would be analgous to updating the sail design.

    However, to keep selling the old blades and new blades side-by-side flies right in the face of one design. Having a different set with a high price tag implies that one set is faster than the other. Of course I guess that's the intent.
     
  11. Deimos

    Deimos Member

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    I thought the builders had a policy of avoiding single source supply for any parts. If that is the case then might the new supplier be a 2nd source (thus, any supply problems with any one part does not stop them supplying boats as they have an alternative).

    Ian
     
  12. Eric_R

    Eric_R D10 Secretary

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    Yah but when LP's territory is North America and Europe and they lose their supplier it's kinda hard to get new parts from the other regions.
     
  13. sailjacks

    sailjacks Member

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    But its also true that the foils Laser has been making the last few years have been really bad, and they chipped frequently and early on.
    I have chartered four times in the last 2 years and the centerboard chipped two of those times (and not from abuse or neglect either). And when it wasn't my blades chipping, it was someone else's.
    As long as they can guarantee that these new blades will have better longevity and durability, I think I'm all for them.
     
  14. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    I find it impossible to believe there are no plastics companies in teh world who are not only quite reliable but quite eager to reverse design an exact duplicate of the Compton blades.

    Even if no company chose to make an exact duplicate, There are many ways to make injection molded plastic paarts and if chipping and cracking is teh REAL reason for seeking a new design, I would submit that simply requesting a mondification of the ingredients and adding fiber to the foam would be the easiest route.

    When it comes to the laser game and keeping our one design toy consistent and afordable, evolution and not revolution is my version of the preferred path.

    I would love to know why Compton would "decide not to build more blades."

    Any company with a reliable client who has consistently paid its bills for 30 years is unlikely to simply cut off that reliable client with no rational reason.

    The lack of freely given information about this sudden need to first have an alternate supplier and now a replacement for that reliable supplier does nothing to supress my belief that there are two ugly sides to the story.
     
  15. torrid

    torrid Just sailing

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    Lots of "one design" classes aren't really one design. For example, something like the Opti or 470 classes. You want a hull, you have your choice of 3 or 4 builders. Same with spars, blades and sails.

    You have to comparison shop when putting a boat together. Certain equipment may or may not be faster, in certain situations. But there are also differences in price, allowing for some degree of marketplace competition.

    We seem to be slowly evolving to the same situaiton in the Laser class. Only all the equipment come from one place.
     
  16. gouvernail

    gouvernail Active Member

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    I simply want a good solid as a rock supplier company where we can purchase reasonably priced equipment to play our game.

    When Lasers were introduced they cost 1/3 the price of a Volkswagon Beetle.

    Currently a Laser on a trailer with covers costs as much as a Kia....

    Fewer tires, no engine, no windshield, no brakes., no heater, no radio, ..need I go on??

    The goal of producing an easily affordable racing sailboat for the singlehander has been abandoned.
     
  17. Deimos

    Deimos Member

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    I notice that these new foils are manufactured in China (Guangdong Province). Which makes me think that maybe cost is the driving factor here. In a reasonable world, reduced manufacturing costs to the builder would result in cheap retail costs. Cynic that I am I suspect this is about margin widening by the builder to increase profit (again).

    Ian
     
  18. Der_Dude

    Der_Dude Member

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    This development makes some class rules look really silly. There have been serious discussions here on wether or not on or two layers of adhesive tape in the center board slot are class legal. If I remember correctly, two layers are not, however different blades are?

    Could somebody from the Tech Committee explain what's going on, please?
     
  19. AlanD

    AlanD Former ISAF Laser Measurer

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    Maybe we should all just go back to the timber boards, I'm sure people complained when the Crompton boards came in making the timber boards obsolete. :rolleyes:

    As has been said previously, the boards whilst using different materials and manufacturing processes, fall within the tolerances (stiffness, weight, etc) specified in the builders manual. From using the Australian made boards, the boards do not warp as easily, are actually true when pulled initally out of the box and don't need to be sanded flat, refinished , they don't appear to have the wires running through them that rusts if near the surface or have large sections snap off. Overall, the product is better from only a cosmetic view point not a measurable performance one.

    If there is an advantage it would disappear by practicing tacking for 2 minutes, There has been no changes in the pecking order in our club based upon who has and doesn't have the boards (a club with multiple current and former Laser World Champions in various divisions). The only thing you need to take care of is knocking the bottom corner edge off the board (never rest the board with the tip going into the bottom of the cockpit.
     
  20. Der_Dude

    Der_Dude Member

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    Thanks.
     

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