Swearing at competitors

Sailorchick

Sailorchick

Member
What are your views on swearing at other competitors. I know we all swear and rant at our boats and ourselves when things are going wrong but I wouldn't dream of swearing and using abusive language at another competitor as sailing/racing is supposed to be fun.

At the event I was at this weekend another competitor really lost it with me. The situation was that we were coming into the windward mark, I was on port (sailing radial) he was on starboard (sailing full rig). As I bore away to duck him he also bore away. Now I was shattered, last race of a windy regatta and I was working hard to beat the only other radial who could get me and was just behind. I was well prepared to duck him but he has to give me opportunity to do so. I did say out loud in exasperation don't bear down on me. His response to this was along the lines of ' you silly f###ing girl, you shouldn't f###ing be there, its a f###ing mark I'm bearing away for' and so on. I threatened to protest him if he swore at me again (on sportsmanship rules) and he launched into another tirade. At this point I'd had enough and told him to shut up and sail (I didn't swear, just, although I'll admit I called him a muppet) I didn't follow the protest up as was beating him on handicap and proceded to sail away from him on the race course. Also had more pressing issue of the other radial just behind.
Other than this it was a fantastic regatta, good strong wind, competitive radial fleet (other than the 2 leading full rigs the radials were beating the full rigs on the water). He just really spoiled the event. Also, I'm not a young inexperienced sailor, I'm 28 and have to guts to shout back, if he was like that to a younger less confident person he could put them off racing for life.

What would your take have been on the situation?
 
well if i was in the back of the fleet and he went and did that and screwed my race up even more, i porbably would of protested him, but im very cranky when im in last(ish) place, other than thatt, i usually just take it say some words back at him and keep sailing.
 
Seems to be a conflict between rule 16.2 and 18 if you were in the zone he was correct though politley hailing for bouy room would be the "proper course" in order to inform you that he was bearing off. If you were outside the zone he was clearly in violation of 16.2. Since he swore at you and did not ask for room before changing course it is not likey he would win a protest against you under 18.2.d. which is what he thought he had rights under. Either way he was wrong and it was unsportsmanlike for him to swear. From the sound of it you could have done a turn and still whomped him (except for that other radial...) So take pleasure in the fact that you beat him soundly and that you held your tongue and only called him a muppet.....

I hope that most hear agreee that abusive language is not appropriate to this sport (or any sport). If he thought you were in violation of the rules he had avenues to protest which is what the rules provide. I don't recall a rule that says a verbal thrashing is in order when a competitor crowds you at a mark.
 
Swearing just doesn't belong out on the race course. If you are fortunate enough to sail in a fleet where it's not tolerated, such as the one I frostbite in, it's a pleasure to sail with everyone. We have had one or two who can't control it and they have been warned on the course, then talked to after sailing (usally a group of people will approach the single individual, it's a little more "persuasive" and if all else fails, a protest. They either adapt or leave the fleet.

Like one or two of the other threads that have come up recently, it's up to each of us to do our part to make sure everyone is playing the same game. Protesting is low on my list of things that I enjoy about racing, but if I see or hear something happening to me, or around me, that I know isn't within the rules, I'm not really making my sport better if I just do nothing..

I know it's tougher when you leave your local fleet and sail in regional, national or international competitions as it seems each fleet, country etc has their own view on what is tolerated and what isn't. Should that mean compromising your standards and adopting the "when in rome, do what the romans do" ? That's a tough call. I think if I were in your situation, I might have tried to have a conversation with the person after the race was over, letting him know that the swearing is over the top, bad for the sport and participation (You are 100% right that it drives both novices and passive people right out of the game) and that I am not going to tolerate it from him again.
 
drwatershed said:
Seems to be a conflict between rule 16.2 and 18 if you were in the zone he was correct though politley hailing for bouy room would be the "proper course" in order to inform you that he was bearing off. If you were outside the zone he was clearly in violation of 16.2.
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Although we were close to the mark I'd say we were more like 3/4 boat lengths away. Very weird shifts going on at the windward mark as it was close to shore so I was leaving lots of room everytime round that mark. There also was no collision as I did manage to bear off enough even with him bearing down on me.
 
That was what I thought. Sounds like he should have held his course. And kept his mouth shut. I agree with 49208's comments. I'm trying to get my kids into sailing and I certainly wouldn't want them verbally abused on the course, nor would I allow them to use that kind of language agasinst another competitor. Sailing is fun. Abusive language is not. The two don't belong together.
 
Abusive language is not only inapropriate, but it is illegal under the ISAF RRS 2005-2008:

ISAF Racing Rules of Sailing 2005-2008 said:
SECTION C
GROSS MISCONDUCT
69 ALLEGATIONS OF GROSS MISCONDUCT
69.1 Action by a Protest Committee
(a) When a protest committee, from its own observation or a report
received from any source, believes that a competitor may have
committed a gross breach of a rule, good manners or sportsmanship,
or may have brought the sport into disrepute, it may
call a hearing. The protest committee shall promptly inform the
competitor in writing of the alleged misconduct and of the time
and place of the hearing.
(b) A protest committee of at least three members shall conduct the
hearing, following rules 63.2, 63.3, 63.4 and 63.6. If it decides
that the competitor committed the alleged misconduct it shall
either
(1) warn the competitor or
(2) impose a penalty by excluding the competitor and, when
appropriate, disqualifying a boat, from a race or the remaining
races or all races of the series, or by taking other action
within its jurisdiction. A disqualification under this rule
shall not be excluded from the boat’s series score.
Click to expand...
 
When I was younger I had a real problem biting my tough when things got close and tough and on many more than one occasion lashed out at other competitors or my crew (depending on what boat I was sailing). I was finally approached by a coach from another team that I greatly respected, he said to me that my outbursts made me look foolish and had absolutely no place in the sport, since then I've really managed to watch my mouth and the "fun level" has increased tremendously.

It's just not worth berating anyone in this sport or any sport for that matter. We are all doing this for fun and the thrill of competition, why do we need to swear, hit, or otherwise violently approach fellow competitors, we don't...
 
The only time that I curse is when a boat tacks on you. But seriously, I try not to. If I'm in last, I will hit the deck a few times, and then just try to start concentrating on gaining boats. It makes you look like a total hack when you scream at the top of your lungs at someone.
 
I agree with the sentiment here. There is no room for abuse and unsportmans like conduct of any kind in sailing. It seems like he was doing both and trying to intimidate you also because your female. Imagine if it was a 16 year old girl in his way.

We all get angry and frustrated and have words with our competitors, but there is a line that should not be crossed.

He should have either apoligized right there on the water or back on land. You did the right thing by tellling him you will protest. This gives you back the upper hand. Even if you crash into someone on port, they can be angry, but it does not give them the right to intimidate or violate rule 69. The penalties are severe.

I am no saint, but I try not to be too much of a pest. Thanks for the post, I for one will be more aware of how I conduct myself on the course. Kudos to you for holding your ground.
 
You should have held the protest. What he said was really uncalled for. I usually cuss at myself on the race course when I'm in the process of capsizing or undergoing some other kind of self inflicted injury, but when it comes to communicating w/other sailors I do my level best not to use foul language. I might raise my voice, but keep the conversation focused on the rule at hand.

The last time I lost my cool at someone was 3 years ago. The guy hit me as hard as he could in 15 knots of breeze to try and prove a point of which he was wrong to begin with. I nearly pulled a Brodie Cobb on that one! However, 2 wrongs do not make a right.
 
Nora171010 said:
what's a brodie Cobb?
Click to expand...

Let's not go there. Suffice to say that Brodie Cobb is currently banned from participating in official races because of a rule 69 infraction ("Gross Misconduct"). If you really want to know the details, you can search this board or Sailing Anarchy for the details.

 
I agree with everyone else a Rule 2/Rule 69 protest was in order. Everyone swears at themselves but abusing another competitor is simply uncalled for.

I know we all get cranky, but if he was at the front of the fleet in that wind he should have the talent and the fitness to be in control (lets not forget rule 16 applies to him being right of way boat too).
 
Interesting to note, in the Moberg case, that his anger issues haven't stopped him getting to Olympic level - in a sailing skill sense. Anti social tendencies obviously don't stop a person sailing exceptionally well. Of course, any olympic committee isn't going to promote an angry olympian. It would be against the philosophy of the Olympics.

A Jedi of the Dark side? Still as good, but just not a nice chap at times?
 
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