New to Forum and new to me Laser

SnowDog

New Member
Hello everyone,

I've been lurking around the forms here for a few weeks and getting lots of good info and tips on it so figured I should sign up. I have worked in the marine industry in all aspects of boat repair for over 20 years and just picked up my first Laser about a month ago. Like all older mid 80's boats it has some minor issues I've been taking care of along the way.
Replaced all the running rigging and added a few blocks and cam cleats to make it easier to adjust from the cockpit. Now before the race crew chimes in I don't ever plan on class racing this boat and got it strictly for recreational sailing. I used to sail windsurfers and wanted something a bit more relaxing to sail but still able to go fast.
I've had a slow leak into the hull that amounts to a few gallons over the course of a few hours of sailing. I re-bedded all the deck and tiller hardware but still had water. Took out the stern plug and did the same with that and added a cut in half garden hose washer to the plug so it might seal better but still getting water. Today I just pulled the auto bailer brass fitting out and re-bedded that as well which hopefully solving my leak issue.
The other thing I discovered today is my mast step is leaking into the hull so looks like I'll be installing a couple of inspection ports and doing some fiberglass work to the mast step later this week.
Been out with it a few times now and starting to get used to it but being a smaller guy (around 130 lbs) with the standard rig it's a bit of a handful when the wind picks up.
If anyone has done the mast step repair and can offer up some advise as to where to put the ports or any other advise I'd appreciate it.

Marc
 
Place inspecton port than mast step repair in the search box and you will find everything you need without hearing a peep from anyone. Good luck, sail fast, and take chances.
 
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Welcome - Dingyj is right, searching on "mast step repair" , leaking mast step , etc will bring up a ton of info.

One inspection port should do the job, located approx 45 degrees (halfway) between centerline and perpendicular to centerline, on the aft side of the mast. Approx 12-18" away from the mast. Once you have cut the hole, if you need more advice, post up some pictures of the base of the tube from inside the hole.

You didn't mention if the leak is at the bottom of the tube (it usually is on boats of that vintage), so you'll most likely end up pouring a new mast step base, and then to keep it from wearing in the future, add a ss wear plate at the bottom

You are right, the full rig is a handful at that weight, but it can become manageable with time in the boat up to approx 20 knots. If you sail in predominantly heavy air, you may enjoy the radial rig more though.
 
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Thanks for the welcome and info. I've found a few threads on the repair with great pics but most lacked the area in which to place the port. The leak is in the bottom of the step and I'll be adding a new base as soon as the repair is finished.
I do have a question on the leveling of the boat. Do you level it at the step or somewhere else?

Wind averages around 5-10 but sometimes pics up to around 15 if it's a good day. It was a bit gusty and shifty this past Sat when I discovered the step leaking. I'm used to sailing overpowered with the windsurfer so I just have to keep alert and ready to dump the main before it reaches critical tilt and I end up swimming LOL.
 
The red dots are the approx area - either side (you should only need one port)

upload_2014-7-28_21-21-2.png


When you pour the base of the new step, you want it level at the step
 
Thanks for the info. Cut the deck open and found the donut was cracked and popped off without much effort. Took a Dremel and ground out most of the old bedding and roughed up the block and hull. Used some West System to make a new filet and bottom of the step. After that set up for a few hours I went back and added a wrap of mat around the base of the tube. Laid up overlapping strips of mat from the tube to the block and finally a larger patch from the base of the tube over the block and onto the hull. Pretty sure the step won't be going anywhere anytime soon.
20140802_114631.jpg
20140802_132146.jpg

20140802_145940.jpg
 
Thanks and it's only a 6" port...I know it's not class legal but it was bad enough trying to do it in that size, 5 would have been rough.

Wavedancer... All depends if you live in New England or not LOL.
 
Don't find that the inspection port modification is allowed on Laser International.com
http://www.laserinternational.org/sites/default/files/Current_Rules.pdf

is there another source?

Found it
"
20. INSPECTION PORTS
Inspection ports not exceeding 153 mm internal diameter
may be installed on the deck or in the cockpit to provide
access to the hull cavity, provided that any inspection
port is fitted with watertight threaded covers (any bayonet
mounted parts are deemed to be not threaded). Storage
receptacles are permitted underneath hatch covers."
 
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I remember seeing a post on this forum that up to 5" was allowed, glad to know it is in fact 6".
As to inspection ports being illegal...that would mean that you could not repair a leaking boat or mast step rendering a perfectly sound boat (like mine) to the scrap yard.
My boat used to get at least a gallon of water into the hull for every hour sailing. With the mast step and hull deck joint repairs I made in addition to rebedding all the fittings I'm happy to say it's a dry boat now.
 
Nice job snowdog. I also sail an old Laser purely for fun, and my mast hole broke and I had to do the whole deck repair - NOT fun - so glad you got yours done before it failed.

Passing along a couple things that I've done with my old boat over the years that have made it a whole lot more fun to sail-

- tied knots in the traveller, limiting the block to a couple inches inboard, which greatly reduces the tendency of the mainsheet to hang up on the aft corner/quarter, when I come about from beam reach to beam reach. I know this affects sail shape, pointing, etc etc but not racing, it makes back+ forth sailing much more fun, less likely to capsize on a tack.
traveller limiter+aft access port- mine.jpg

- I put a swivelling cam cleat on the mainsheet- big help.
mainsheet block mine 1.jpg

- Got a new tiller extension, with a true universal joint- piece of line/rubber. My boat is old enuf that it had the old 2-pivot U-joint (like in a truck's driveshaft).

- I bought all 3 rigs so I can put up a smaller sail as the wind gets stronger. It's not exactly cheap, but it's a kick to be able to get out on a rough day, with a little sail on a short mast. It just makes a world of difference in a gusty + shifty wind. The short mast makes the "hit" from a change in direction or windspeed way less. They're much less expensive as "practice" parts from Intensity or APS.

I'm a BIG fan of keeping these old Lasers going even tho my racing days are long gone. Hoping racers whose boat is no longer legal or competitive doesn't scrap it - sell it to a recreational guy. IMO an old Laser back + forth some afternoon is about the most fun for the least money of anything I know on water. Some of these rec guys will be decide they wanna race too.

Hope you get a kick on yours-
 
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PS one other thing - I did a DIY version of the 15:1 vang upgrade, and that also made a big difference in flattening + de-powering the sail, and the flat sail really reduced the "hit" in gusty and shifty conditions. The DIY version saved a bunch of $ -- let me know if you want, I'll go take a picture of it. And if you do a higher purchase vang, I'd recommend flipping the boom (end for end), and installing the reinforcing sleeve. The 15:1 gives plenty enuf pull to just break an old boom without the sleeve.

have fun -
 
Thanks for the info and pics. I would love to see the vang setup you made. I hadn't thought about adding a knot to the traveler as I do have an issue with the sheet hanging up esp in higher winds. I've thought about shaping a piece of foam insulation and glassing it into the corners to eliminate the catch point on the rail. I also know it is completely class illegal but I'm strictly a recreational sailor that likes to go fast.
As for the boom I'm trying to find a source for the proper tube size and build a new one if I can't find a used on locally that's in good shape and not too pricy.
 
Here's a couple shots of the DIY vang setup- 5:1 pulling on the tail of the original 3:1.vang 1.jpg vang 2.jpg

vang mast block 2.jpg vang mast block 1.jpg

Hardware is:
- double becket block on the tail of the old 3:1
- 2 single blocks just tied thru a hole in the cheek of the old mast-end block
- "standard vang swivel" from APS ($15). definitely made it easier to trim/ease- allows the mast-end block to swivel towards the direction I'm pulling.
- Bent vang tang, which I think might have come from Intensity (not sure).
- I also got that quick-release pin to move it easily between the different lower mast sections (std, radial, 4.7) depending on how much it's blowing that day.

Lines: in the original 3:1 is 3/16", I think it's Excel (purple).
5:1 part is 3mm New England Finish Line (red).

On a different topic but also "how to have fun on a Laser" -- I think you mentioned you're in New England. I've been sailing for 20+ years in cold water/weather in Ohio. Up til this winter/spring I was doing it in layers of neoprene wetsuit gear, and a dingy smock top. It worked by limiting the infiltration rate to low enuf that even 35-40* water was OK. This spring I finally broke the piggy bank and bought a low-end Gill drysuit. I gotta say, now having sailed in that- if I had known how much better the drysuit is than the layers of wetsuit gear, I'd have stopped buying layers of wetsuit pieces, saved up, and got the drysuit first, years ago. It's just the cat's pajamas IMO for cold water sailing.
 
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I hadn't thought about adding a knot to the traveler as I do have an issue with the sheet hanging up esp in higher winds. I've thought about shaping a piece of foam insulation and glassing it into the corners to eliminate the catch point on the rail.

I thought about the foam + glass insert thing too. But you can see I went down the "path of least resistance" - the knot thing took 2 minutes, cost nothing, of course was (is) easily reversible. It seems to work 97% of the time for how I tack/sail (mostly tacking beam reach to beam reach) so I'm not so very motivated to try to fix the last little bit of the problem. If you end up doing a foam+glass thing I'd sure love to see a pic of what you do, and hear how it works.
 
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After learning how to pull the slack out of the main as the boom is coming across during jibes... and thereby eliminating the traveler block end of the main getting caught on the transom... I started applying the technique during tacks. Not during tacks when you are closed hauled but during those "beam reach to beam reach" tacks.

When you are doing beam reaches/broad reaches, like I was doing during the Little Harbor video, you've got all that slack in the main when you want to tack immediately. I'll usually head up a bit and take up some of the slack but if you want to bang over quickly on to a new tack because you see a gust approaching that you want to get to, you want to be able to change directions quickly. So you're left with all that loose main sheet.

What I discovered works is as soon as the main starts to luff as I'm heading up from, say, a beam reach, I'll give big tug on the main sheet. This takes a lot of the slack out. Then as the boom is coming across as I tack, I grab the main again right at the forward block on the boom and give it another yank as the boom comes over my head. I found that this is enough to keep the main sheet from hanging up on the corner of the transom during beam reach to beam reach tacks.

One other thing I've started doing is getting into the habit of taking a quick glance at the (new) leeward end of the traveler as I position my body on the new tack. Just to make sure that the block and the main sheet have made it over there without hanging up.

On occasion... usually when I've been lazy and haven't pulled enough on the main sheet to take the slack out during the tack... I'll see that the main has hung up on the transom. But if I know this, by looking in advance, before I bear off and the sail loads up, it's an easy matter of quickly heading up, reaching over to the corner of the transom and clearing the line. Also much easier to clear the line if it's not under a big load yet.

Nice to know that what seemed to be a big issue (the main and traveler block getting caught) can be pretty much completely eliminated with technique alone.

- Andy
 
Maybe the Laser Rules should allow larger ports for mast step repairs it its rule book. Plus recommendations on how to do
them so not to comprimise the "one-design" concept.
 

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