De-powering a Laser Radial Upwind

S

SailorT

New Member
If you are a light weigh laser radial sailor what are the best upwind techniques to keep the laser from being over on its ear, and being slow? What can be done to de-power the sail? Should the boat be luffed up in the puffs, or should the sail be easied in the puff and then pulled back in once the puff dies down? What are the fastest up wind techniques for light weights in a heavy weight blow?
 
ok well in the puffs you should sheet out as u said and as far as sail controls you can pull on your Cunningham and if after this you still have to depower try pulling on your vang this way when you sheet out you can still keep sail shape.
 
never point up in the gusts, its much easier but extremely slow

pull the cunningham right on, outhaul right on (but never so tight that the sail is taut) and have enough vang on so that when you ease the sail, the boom goes out and not up
 
When they say cunningham they mean CUNNINGHAM!! When it's really blowing out there and I can't hold the boat flat I have it cranked on so the eyelet is at the gooseneck. If I know it's going to be windy out there, I'll rig the cunningham on one side of the boom so I can get it down even further. That line will be your best friend in a blow.
 
Hello Sailor "T",
One thing to think about when your out in heavy breeze is that when you crank on the controls really hard you are greatly increasing the loads on the sail and spars... With the new rigging you really risk increasing the chances of damaging/bending or even breaking the upper and lower mast and boom. Also you don't want to use a new crispy sail even if it has been broken in properly cause you stretch the hell out of it by pulling the cunningham eye down so far.
Best regards,
Fishingmickey
150087/181157
 
Dick Tillman suggests in his book (The Complete Book of Laser Sailing) to raise the board 5-6" when overpowered going upwind. I suppose this will make the boat slip sideways. And I also suppose that this won't bring you to the mark optimally. True or False?
 
Raising the board is a big help for. Yesterday there was 25 knot winds with consistant 30+ knot gusts, and I had the board up 4"-6" all day. There's slightly more side slipping, but the speed you gain from keeping her flat is easily enough to make up for lost boat lengths.
 
Is it just as beneficial to raise the centre board in a full rig as in a radial??

I've never heard of it before, so ill give it a try next time
 
3335 said:
Board up keeps you flat?!
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Yes, it does.

Raising the board by even 2-3 inches brings the center of lateral resistance (C.L.R., the board and rudder) aft, closer to the center of effort (C.E., the sail). This lessens the effects of heeling. The closer the C.L.R. and the C.E. are together, the less force spills over that you have to counteract. Why do we bring the draft forward (tightening everything up) when it gets windier and we're overpowered? because that does the same thing, bringing the two forces closer together. Raising the board just brings them closer from the other direction.


Also, bringing the board up 2-3 inches doesn't actually induce much more leeway, it only changes the C.L.R.

This is some pretty technical stuff, so don't be surprised if it's confusing-it confused me for years.
 
SailorT said:
If you are a light weigh laser radial sailor what are the best upwind techniques to keep the laser from being over on its ear, and being slow? What can be done to de-power the sail? Should the boat be luffed up in the puffs, or should the sail be easied in the puff and then pulled back in once the puff dies down? What are the fastest up wind techniques for light weights in a heavy weight blow?
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I would sugest tighting the cunningham (pulls sail up and down) as tight as possable then tighting the outhoul so you have a nice flat sail
 
My coaches have always said to use vang (of course) then serious cunningham. If that's still not enough, then tighten outhaul as a last resort. Tightening the cunningham makes the sail flatter, but using moderate outhaul gives you enough foreward power to get through the waves which come along with big wind.
 
When I was racing hard, the top local Radials (ie 3 time world Masters champ, current Apprentice world champ, 4th in Open worlds, oh and 3rd in Radial Open worlds) did NOT pull the outhaul on. Even when you are overpowered, you still have to get SOME power from somewhere - and it's better to get it lower down where there is less leverage to capsize you. Compensate for that by easing the sheet more, and remember NEVER cleat the thing, keep trimming instantly and furiously to the fluctuations. The harder you work, the faster you go.
 
Well, I sail a full rig, and I'm a complete noobie, so take it as that. Yesterday we had some consistent 10-12 knot winds with gusts to 18. I weigh 170 and with the sheet all the way in and full hike couldn't keep it flat, heading up would depower in a hurry but killed speed too much, I just laid back in a full hike and controlled the power with the mainsheet to keep it right on the edge (which was still a 20 degree tilt) and then would have to head up when the big puffs came to keep from capsizing. Had a great day yesterday also. Man these boats power up quick.

I really have to try the centerboard technique. I can deal with a small amount of sideslip in order to sacrifice flatness.

I was on the lake and gave a harpoon and a precision 185 abotu a 300 yard head start on a borad reach leg. I closed it to approximately 75 yards by the end of that leg. Surprised the heck out of me. Man I love these boats.
 
Bunky9590 said:
Well, I sail a full rig, and I'm a complete noobie, so take it as that. Yesterday we had some consistent 10-12 knot winds with gusts to 18. I weigh 170 and with the sheet all the way in and full hike couldn't keep it flat, heading up would depower in a hurry but killed speed too much, I just laid back in a full hike and controlled the power with the mainsheet to keep it right on the edge (which was still a 20 degree tilt) and then would have to head up when the big puffs came to keep from capsizing. Had a great day yesterday also. Man these boats power up quick.

I really have to try the centerboard technique. I can deal with a small amount of sideslip in order to sacrifice flatness.

I was on the lake and gave a harpoon and a precision 185 abotu a 300 yard head start on a borad reach leg. I closed it to approximately 75 yards by the end of that leg. Surprised the heck out of me. Man I love these boats.
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Instead of heading up in the puffs, ease, then hike and trim. You'll never lose boat speed and you won't capsize either as long as you have the timing right.

Merrily
 
Merrily said:
Instead of heading up in the puffs, ease, then hike and trim. You'll never lose boat speed and you won't capsize either as long as you have the timing right.

Merrily
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Thanks for the tip. The timing is the thing I'll have to work on. Moving up from a sunfish I've found the laser to be most unforgiving of even the slight mistakes. The sunfish would allow for some slow reactions. Not the laser, uh uh, no way.


I'll have to get back out in the breezes and work on the timing along with the centerboard out slightly and find the right mix. Practice, practice, practice.

Thanks again for the response.
 
Bunky9590 said:
Thanks for the tip. The timing is the thing I'll have to work on. Moving up from a sunfish I've found the laser to be most unforgiving of even the slight mistakes. The sunfish would allow for some slow reactions. Not the laser, uh uh, no way.


I'll have to get back out in the breezes and work on the timing along with the centerboard out slightly and find the right mix. Practice, practice, practice.

Thanks again for the response.
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I would try cranking down on the cunningham/vang as hard as you can before you try the centerboard part... That's more of a survival conditions thing, like 25+ knots, because if you do it before you're completely and totally overpowered, and even ease-hike-trim isn't helping, THEN you should pull up the board.
 
computeroman2 said:
I would try cranking down on the cunningham/vang as hard as you can before you try the centerboard part... That's more of a survival conditions thing, like 25+ knots, because if you do it before you're completely and totally overpowered, and even ease-hike-trim isn't helping, THEN you should pull up the board.
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Thank you very much. I'll be workign on my ease, hike trim tomorrow for a good portion of the morning /afternoon. Its probably just a lot of feel based experience to get the timing down. The advice is appreciated.
 
Ok, I'm in your shoes, Im 115 at 6ft, yeah thats not a typo, The key is to lift up the board that little bit, then then crank on the controls, for the outhaul and cunningham to really crank 'er down, put your feet in the front of the cockpit crouch down and grab the control line, then stand up and back towards the back of the boat, then trim in the sail all the way and then give the vang hell.
 
Is everybody ready - A lot of the techniques and even the ideal weight is going to change with the introduction of the carbon upper for the radial.... coming soon to a race course near you....
 
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